Mufti's Meetup 😉🤟 [Novemeber session]

alright let me just salaam folks afraid of right afraid let me just check that this is going live um right let me just [Music]

right [Laughter] um all right so mejente vampire

greetings to all my fellow my fellow fellow walkers of this path so let's see what's going down who is alive i mean who is awake and alive at this god forsaken hour

so i could see a few people tuning in all right people you can click like click share you know the drill up all right that i have to repeat these things you know the drill click like click share spread the love people the the low lillo that's it so let me take this uh go back to comments all right greetings from berlin people

oh han you're doing it oh hon you're doing it what's this right who have we got in the house people you can switch on your cameras let me um afraid so i could do azerati you do and it much love much love i'm good where are you joining us from from southampton southampton look at that uk vampires

people that's what i'm talking about so afraid so welcome share with us your your thoughts or comments that you might want to express let me just move this out the way yep afraid hassan so is there something you'd like to share with us a statement a confession no confession but it's more um yeah i've been listening to you for a few years now and yes a few years

you've never reached you've never reached out before i've um i actually came to one of your q a's in 2018 at the office me and a few guys from loughborough university you you might remember you might remember right okay now that you're saying lothbro university yes i do that rings a bell alright well it's good to see you again and hear from you so what's going down man what's

what's on your mind i had a question regarding the uh splitting of the moon what was your take on that come on how can you be following me for all these years and not know my take [Laughter] this one these are not nice you know this one so this one just maska so yeah i mean i've got look i've got a detailed video on it so i think when i say detailed it's not so long but it's

it just goes into more detail so i think watching that would definitely be good but briefly um to me these things that they were i don't i don't feel the moon actually split but it may have been perceived in that way and that's what um ibn ashur in history alludes to he says that you know it may have been an eclipse a partial eclipse which was then perceived as the moon splitting because some of the narrations actually mentioned the word eclipse

so yeah so that's my take on it man but shukran shook around for that man stay tuned do keep sharing your thoughts and comments and like and subscribe and check out my youtube channel man if that's you see with that question i'm i'm doubting that you've checked out much of my oh i've actually seen i've seen most of your videos i was watching your andalus series yesterday i was watching

[Laughter] much love for tuning in and coming on live insha'allah stay tuned take care in the house all the way from southampton afraid doing it doing it uh right so let's see who do we have here got a few people those of you wanting to tune in i mean not tune in sarik come on live i've shared the link i'll share it again um

let me just share that i don't know what link i'm sharing look at that miriam says wow that was short you know it gives other people a chance as well it kind of like keeps it moving you know you know how it is so all right clear you do and it you do in it all right so faceo i also have the alpha t gear yeah dude let's see who have we got here we've got saheb and another saheb

all right so hey son you're doing it to the meetup man where are you joining us from your mic is muted look at that accent you're doing it with that accent man that's that's what we're talking about all right me my brother been watching your videos for a long time i really really like your videos man just keep up sugar and man saheb i appreciate it shook him chicken and all right so i just wanted to ask you a

question regarding um your views on the caliphate i think you've talked about this before but we see like a lot of scholars especially in pakistan as well they talk about like kind of the utopia vision or they want the caliphate to come back but if you look in history sometimes you can see it sometimes it was very oppressive especially in like the the abbasids and some sometimes the bandwagon so i'm just wondering what's your views do you think that the caliphate system is islamic or do you think it's something that um muslims have added on themselves i mean it's you see there's a a couple of things there bundled together there's a nostalgic kind of

uh utopian fantasy that has never really existed but people yearn for a glorious past so you find that in all faiths people will feel that oh we're in some terrible time and we need to return to some utopia and so that's not exclusive to islam or to muslims human beings tend to behave that way so you'll find that in many faiths many religions and unfortunately islam is no different

so you're going to see in you know muslims also and then they you see then there's the question okay what are these these golden days that we need to return to so here comes this notion of the khilafah this caliphate now if one asks them to break it down what exactly when was this golden caliphate era exactly so people might speak about sedna umar radhillah which really is just a decade of rulership but so you'd ask them what is that is it just like

10 years 20 years 30 i mean out of 1400 30 plus years how many years have been this glorious kind of caliphate of which you don't like that sorry to interrupt you but you're not finding it interesting how you see um for example a lot of i've studied a lot of wet picking school we used to study what western scholars would say and i was always interested what the western scholars would say about islam so you have like 17th century um edward gibbon like a lot of these girls yeah a lot of these people would describe the golden years of islam like under the caliphates of people like haruna rasheed and under the army in spain but i think as muslims we kind of view differently when we talk about the golden age we're

kind of talking about as you said um we're talking about from a religious aspect but from an from a secular aspect and people are talking about the golden age of um the caliphate they're kind of looking at the vital hikmaiah and baghdad and all these places so i find interesting when we look at from a religious viewpoint we're thinking about the the kind of four rightly guided caliphs when you look at it from a non-religious viewpoint you're looking at the kind of them abbasid kind of rule you know what i mean of course of course i mean i totally agree and and you know that and i think we have to and it's not about you know you've highlighted i know you mentioned gibbon and there's other people as well

but they may have had a um you know sometimes a very oh a critical perspective of islam and may have been harsh and prejudiced in their ways as well but it's not about them or these people you see we it just takes reason one can just reflect over history and ask that when is this golden period of islam and what do we mean by that this you know do we mean that when muslims just had a lot of wealth do we mean by that there was some sense of justice because to be honest with you haruna rasheed

is not really known for an age of justice i think that's a misha attribution it's more that during his time uh the beetle hickman the revival at this an an element of tolerance they definitely i mean unquestionably muslims had a lot of tolerance in the past much more than they have today ironically so muslims today are quite um you know sometimes they're very um discriminatory and very kind of uh reactionary but whereas in the past they were quite quite tolerant actually and that ties into your own

self of you know self-esteem and um kind of insecurities or lack of them so the more secure you are as a person the more tolerant you are of others and the the more insecure you are the more intolerant you become and so yeah so it is actually a a fantasy it which has never happened that said the question of khilafah is a different question why the you know this this caliphate that people this this term this phenomenon you give it a name um in my understanding i've said this before that the word khilafah

never existed with this meaning in the quran and this is a post-islamic occurrence so prior to islam the arabic word khilafah did exist but it didn't mean what it meant after islam it turned into this kind of political term a term meaning like kind of governance global governance or governance it didn't ev it didn't mean that um what it meant but i think there's like him a very famous adidas a lot of people use that the prophet said that like blessed are like the four righteous like righteous khalis after me do you think that hadith yeah i

think all of these are fabricated all of these hadith on the khilafah and the evidence for it you see there's only two ways this this could happen one is that um you could say okay first of all uh let's go with my way that these are fabricated why are they fabricated because this term did not exist this word to mean this did not exist that's point number one that there was khilafah was not ever used to mean rulership it was never used like that and it meant a kind of like an

inheritance like something that comes afterwards so the arabic word did exist so it's like saying for example you know um i i give like let's say technological examples we have today your uh the word like prime minister like before this word came into existence the word minister would have existed and the word prime would have existed but it wasn't used in this particular way so if somebody if you take this word to a date when they never had this word

that is suspect then that um you know is this authentic because how were they using this word at that time when this word was not around like that so in a similar way that's point number one linguistically this word does not mean it's even in the quran when allah says you know about yesterday or where he says about dawood al-islam this was not you see people are reading into this post islam they're reading into this after the caliphate system has

already been set up and muslims have set this into motion and now they're reading backwards and they're thinking oh well adam was made a khalifa and this is what a khalifa means and so it's but that's wrong you you're projecting your views onto the quran and then reading them back so that's not it you see it was the same thing it meant to somebody that comes after and inherits that's what it meant it was not about governance why you see that he was a khalifa le nas this was talking about the jewish people

david although king david he was a king um and that's what he's generally you know remembered as amongst the jewish people and christians as this great king uh king david he was never for the entire humanity he was never i mean he was he did rule over a vast if we take that theory that uh to be true that he ruled over a vast empire now he inherits from the judges now the pro you see one of the problem is muslims

we are not very familiar with the judeo-christian kind of history now much of the quran is addressing them because in the time of the prophet the prophet would be face to face with a lot of jewish scholars rabbis and other people that the makkans and at times in madina would be you know would be brought before him so either the makkans would go to the northern kingdoms they would bring back people to debate the prophet and in medina uh at times people would come and they

would debate the prophet and the prophet was presenting to them revelation that they would understand but then we've had this disconnect so islam starts to develop it starts to kind of have its own culture and we then forget about their history that these were the people so imagine i'm talking to you now uh you're from glasgow you said now you're from scotland you're from the uk i may use certain things where we have a shared narrative about what we're talking about you see like right now i could be speaking that uh actually

i don't know whether yeah i mean scotland's in in a lockdown right now isn't it i think it is yeah so imagine i'm speaking in a way where we both understand that there's a lockdown so if you if i was to say something like well well you know you can't find any uh clothes shops around you that are available to do this like imagine i'm saying this and 300 years from today somebody is watching this and they think oh so where you live there must have been no merchants at all

like you must have lived in some remote but obviously i was speaking in a context of a lockdown which you understood because you were from that very same paradigm and we understood what we're talking about so this is exactly what's going on people are forgetting that these verses of about bani israel were addressing the jewish people now the and they had this history so you see in with the the jewish narrative is that when the people of israel when the israelites come to to

to the to the holy land right which was kanan okay which was the middle east which included what modern-day uh israel palestine parts of maybe jordan lebanon this kind of region was the land of canaan and it had the canaanites that lived there now joshua eventually goes there moses does not manage to to kind of make it across with joshua they are successful they do kind of uh get there now the holy land is then set up this this process now initially they don't have any rulers they don't have any kings

and what happens is they kind of get these chiefs that emerge these chiefs are referred to as judges so in the old testament you have the book of judges the book of judges does not refer to judges like a judge giving a you know like in a court the judges in the book of in the book of in the old testament are referring to these kind of chiefs who are there's 12 of them and they are ruling they kind of like they've made a kind of allegiance in a way that that this is these are the the superiors of

the israelites that they would go to but it's not organized and many of these become corrupt so what happens is the israelites are getting attacked by the philistines the philistines are not the palestinians by the way i know you you probably you'd probably know this but i remember once listening to some uh hezbollah person going on about how the philistines were originally part of the canaanites because look they were there it was the philistines in the bible those philistines are not the palestinians of later on those philistines were goliath and

and those people so they were totally different people but so they're getting attacked and they're getting battered and getting beaten and you know sometimes they might have a bit of success but it wasn't really happening so what happens is at the end of all of this the israelites realize that the only way we're going to have success is we need a king so up until now they haven't had a king so you get uh samuel who is the prophet samuel now he kind of comes to this this this understanding and he anoints a king king saul but it goes terribly

wrong and it's not really it's like a prototype version and from him from our following his reign comes out of nowhere king david because he's this kind of shepherd and he's the last person you'd expect to to kind of rise to the ranks but obviously he does and he is then this successor who inherits what all these judges these chiefs had left behind and he will become this uh supreme iconic example for the israelites as a whole up until today he is the

he's their blueprint you know king david so when allah quotes the we have made you this person who has inherited from the judges from the 12 different judges and this failed attempt of saul we have made you the inheritor that's what it was it was not a caliphate system this was not and people are misreading the quran so

um yeah but so that's one way to look at it that you say well look linguistically this did not exist so the other issue was if there was if the prophet was telling people about khulafah follow the four khulafah after me and do this and do that then in all honesty that the prophet would have if the prophet was going to tell us the system after him he would have just settled the sunnisha debate that's exactly what i said that's exactly you see because it would be it would be neglectful that's what you see one would be you

know charging the prophet you know with neglect if you're to say that there was to be this travesty that would befall the ummah and the prophet which in the hadith he says i'm not going to tell you see this is the irony they they come to the prophet and say tell us what in bukhari tell us what to do after you and he says bring a pen and bring this but then he refuses and he says that you guys will figure it out and he says i fear that if i write something that it may kind of become a curse because

you see then people will be like because the moment you give a particular rule some people might interpret it to mean this some people might mean that what if that doesn't work that way what if you know like imagine the prophet appoints someone and that person dies and and so rather than this just leave it to the people you guys will figure it out now this is in contrast to the prophet saying oh there will be hulafa and there will be a khilafah system and there will be this and there will be that it's nonsense and and they didn't even know this word that they come up with this word let's what shall we call you i know we'll call you

khalifa most of the khulafah went by amir al-mu'min they did not because they had this system and it was bani umayya who revive this word khalifa in an attempt to forge authenticity but yes so that's one way the other way of looking at it is now these hadith are true but this word did not exist so it could be that people over 150 years later when they are transmitting this uh hadith they re paraphrase it into a word that now exists so that this could be the other interpretation but

the problem with that once again is it the second point of the first argument it doesn't contend with because if the prophet was going to tell people about a system he would have told them about he would have settled the sunnisha debate because yeah so great i hope that's of some help we did go go on there but uh cool all right so hey it's been epic thank you very much stay tuned man much appreciated take care stay blessed all right people that right there

so he uh with an intricate question i thought you know it's definitely um look at this frankie i need a beta t-shirt you know today is uh international or it was yesterday i guess or in some parts of the world still today international men's day i didn't know there was a men's day until i i saw it on social media saying it's international men's day i thought okay i don't know what happens on international you know you have insta

stories so i was putting up a story and so then it goes into people's stories here so next next and i and that's where i saw its international men's day and i ended up on certain stories and there was a a post by i don't you know once again i had no idea who the person was but they said you know oh happy you know about international men's day that it's great and you know we should celebrate men's thing and a big up really you know a big

wow to every to all uh trans men queer men um by men uh men who are trampled down by other men all this you know just and i thought and then the next page i i remember reading that i'm thinking you know what like i don't i don't get this honestly i just don't get it and the next page said um you know uh so disgust like it was a hate page

it was a hate kind of post to all men who because of them uh trans men are suffering on um you know just other non-alpha men are suffering due to this um toxic kind of masculine men out there and because of them other men haven't been able to tune into their emotions

and i was reading this and i had to comment i don't even know who the person is but i put a comment on this so they probably got it in their messages i said why so much hate like okay why you know okay i didn't even know there was a men's day but if there is and you want to celebrate it i don't know what that means to celebrate a men's day but sure but it it still hating on me and why is it that if you're gonna celebrate you're only cheering and cheering for just trans men and you know queer men and gay men what about the majority of

men who are none of these categories [Laughter] yeah i saw some funny posts you know i i saw this other post by someone and um he was a muslim and he seems like he's some writer or something so i did message him saying i'd love for you to come on to uh mind trap and we could have a discussion i don't know whether he'll accept it but he was also he had this post about women have to pick up the bill basically for men uh not

creating an environment of feelings like because men don't cry and don't show their feelings so they've created this environment and well a big thank you for doing that because now the other men can't do it either and who suffers it's the women who have to pick up the you know what let me i don't know if i can still find it because i commented so maybe because of that i could find it let me read this out because because i i thought to myself like surely that you know like what the hell are these people on about

let me see if i've um because i sent a message you should show up right yeah it has men have no friends and women bear the burden this this is the post toxic masculinity and the persistent idea that feelings are a female thing in in speech marks has left a generation of straight men stranded on emotionally stunted island unable to forge intimate relationships with other men it's women who are paying the price

so this person was sharing it saying it's a very interesting article um his name is hassam i don't know whether he's got some links to jerkin institute but it says he's a um he's got a substantial following several thousands of people but i have messaged him hassam munid i said i'd love to chat about this i mean i don't understand why these kind of charges are kind of levied up again against men because i feel like you know if men okay fair enough i think it's good to be able to share your feelings and

you see you've got to understand it is hard for men to do that because obviously you know it's not a very manly thing to do but cello in a safe environment to share it i think that's good and everybody needs to do that but um i don't know why you gotta blame people for it though like fair enough if people are suffering they suffer in silence and it's a shame that they have to suffer in silence but then to kind of to kind of like blame them for it and attack them for why are you suffering in silence damn it i know just cry

anyway who have we got on here all right people coming in um has been waiting for a while let's bring him in people are ahmad how are you doing i'm good where are you joining us from ahmed i'm in england look at that tonight i've caught the vampires haven't i yeah you're doing it man is there as a comment a statement or a question you'd like to share with us tonight

on this blessed night yes well you probably don't remember but um on i i sent an article to you on instagram and it was about you know when you talked to the light within you were asking about the in surah sajdah where it says the who is the who referring to sorry against

uh i studied under him and uh i wanted to give him right you've you've come on previously and spoken about uh ramadisa yeah you follow his yes yes i remember look at that man come on people i've not there isn't uh alzheimer's hasn't kicked in yet [Laughter] so all right cool yeah so i just wanted to present the video you know what thinking about it you've actually got a bit of that remedy look going on you know [Laughter] i don't know if people can see it you know it's i think is it is it the glasses and and the eyebrows the kind of style of it

and the i can see i can see how this are venue [Laughter] yeah he's actually in in two days he has a live meetup and i'm registered for that as well so i'm going to ask questions yeah so about this i want you to give my view because i i love your uh your like your bastion of reason i disagree with you on quite a few things but i still absolutely love you and shukran shukran much appreciated

so i so let's i guess i mean i can do it fast i guess so you know where so andy saab would say that where says that this is referring to the so he basically says that like you say that they used to be human oh wait just sorry just to be just so we understand this you've asked this to harm this have you yeah you've read this or you've read this from the sabbath i've read this from gandhi excellent so okay so okay so how do they explain it okay that's interesting so because sorry so just before we jump

in uh what do they accept evolution wholeheartedly or no what what they would say is they accept evolution but they don't accept the common ancestry between chimps and humans and you you'll see you you understand in a sense okay sure okay so okay so where is this oh right so they evolution has happened but adam was unique basically com they grandis i would say that common ancestry doesn't have enough proof as it is because of the cambrian explosion not having much previous data before then it being based it's more of a hypothesis rather than a

theory but he says that the quran can't accept common ancestry because of this ayat so because the just to be clear on his opinion because there is the view of like jamal dean lafrani and muhammad abdul and those people that look evolution is not a problem in fact jamal dean of rani who was a contemporary of charles darwin when he read his origin of species he said that there's nothing new here we already believe in this he said the only difference is we believe adam so you know whether they were homonyms and neanderthals and he's you know i'm not denying that

obviously they weren't calling them neanderthals at that stage but whatever they were these things he's saying i'm not denying it but what we're saying is adam was he he was saying this this is that adam was a miracle so evolution has happened up until this point and then there's a miraculous intervention for adam and then we've continued from there that's the kind of uh the um the arab kind of uh reconciliation uh method and i think yasir khadi is also kind of on that flex now

but okay is this is this fairly uh similar yeah so okay so he would say that the three stages are given in sura so he would say the beginning was from clay from the clay right and the nature of this beginning it would have been from wallahu and that he grew like so he would say that this bringing from the theme the same thing that happens in the mother's stomach today it happened in the earth and then the humans came out of the earth right but this is not adam and eve this

is just humans they're like the the animal humans they don't have any consciousness or any soul right then soma jalan aslam is these humans who right now they don't reproduce they just come out from the ground like plants then their progeny it came from this came from reproduction as we know it today then what happened now this is the evolution part this is where he's being perfected some things are being changed

then the the blow the blow was blown into him and this was adam and eve this one human was chosen and he he out of these people out of these humanoids who were being evolved they he was chosen and then from him came all of us with consciousness the people with with the soul so that's what he would say so it refers to insane as those humanoids so that's what you would say what do you think about that you see you know this a bit of like you mentioned something about that there was a

you know and it kind of mirrors the stages of hamel as well of uh pregnancy the kind of gestation period this is you do see the um ontogeny recapitulates um phylogeny so this theory that ontogeny that basically the way um the the fetus develops this used to be a theory that the way the fetus develops in the womb it reflects uh the evolution of the species

uh over the kind of eon or not or the era in which it occurred you've kind of got a miniature version going on in a fetus in the womb and it's reflecting so so they would say that ontogeny recapitulates uh was a phylogeny that's it so now this right okay but this has been disproven scientifically you see what i would say is that the issue with all of this that what um whether what jamal latin latina uh is saying oh what uh more importantly

what ramdisab is saying because he's saying in much more layers in layers like you know there were these there was this stage when this was happening there was this stage when this is happening and then there was this stage you see the problem with this is you're already going into an explanation of anthropology of um of of of of nature of uh you you of biology you're already explaining stuff now you see whereas i suppose in some ways

in some ways what jamal dinafrani was doing is he wasn't really going into it he was just saying i don't have a problem with all of that but adam in the quran seems like the language seems to imply that he was a miracle so i'm just not accepting this it's kind of almost like blind theology you're kind of going in okay other people are going in completely blind with theology they're just saying you know we don't care about anything the world was created in six days god said six days so six days they said this you know they said the earth is flat they said

uh seven thousand years is the age of the earth that's just blind dogma yeah what jamal is doing he's kind of going in just slightly blind like he's just saying well this particular point i'm just going to be blind on the problem with this ramadisa's approach if it be how you've explained it is he is explaining he's going into kind of paleontology he's going into um creation explaining how uh anthropological formation took place he's saying look well man was created like this there was some clay there was this form there was

and look we know the cambrian explosion we know this we know this the problem the problem with this yeah that's my addition that he said oh right okay he says that the theory is not very strong and my reasoning on that would be because of the explosion he says uh uh was it that you put a an elephant on the leg of a locust that your theory the theory is that's what he says but i i received that the the truth is that you see i respect ahmedizab immensely uh you know he is somebody very um uh

you know to me he i i absolutely love him but that said look he is overwhelmingly or he's just like um incalculably under trained in in science and he wouldn't underst like for him to say that there is not enough evidence just means he doesn't understand it because the evidence today for evolution is not the fossils the evolution today is dna yeah like dna is mathematical it's not like you see like if you're seeing like imagine i'm seeing a pattern

of there's a number two and everything's going up in twos let's just say it's two four eight sixteen and then when you've reached in the thousands there's a number missing and there's a number after it the sequence carries on now you can quite easily figure out what that number is but if somebody was to say to you no but look these numbers have just been written randomly somebody just decided to write two then just decided to write four then just decided to write eight now you but you can see the pattern now we can see how our dna uh how we

we can see all of dna that we have mapped out where it connects you can see where mammals split off you can see where homonym split off you can see where a mouse the dna shares with humans you can in fact when they supplant certain things and they do experiments on let's grow a an ear on the back of a mouse it only works because of it being a mammal and it's shearing that dna it doesn't you see so today the the arguments for evolution are not what darwin wrote of course so i think a lot of people

muslims haven't caught up with this religionists they still kind of like not understanding what how evolution is explained like you see when you're shown a um you know like an animal and you see something else you obviously it looks crazy there's no way this thing came from that thing you would think like that doesn't make any sense and that meant that's understandable from your perspective because you're thinking yeah obviously this doesn't look like that but if you alter just one dna

uh you know codon the the impact it could have is drunk maybe drastic so and it would change so if you watch these things where they show you that oh with subtle changes to the dna things absolutely change they're not and then it makes sense oh now i understand so i get that ramadis you know if he doesn't understand it don't get me wrong look gamdi-sab is amazing but he is not somebody brought up in the west uh he obviously

spent most his life brought up in pakistan now obviously pakistan that part of the world isn't so huge on science now later on at this stage of life he has opened up to you know learning about science and stuff but it's it's going to it's not it doesn't come as a terrible surprise to me if he doesn't fully kind of grasp this and i'm not saying this in a way to diss him it's just like i understand it's not you know he's from a a different culture ultimately and he's not been brought up with this kind of way of thinking but yeah that's what i would say

generally i've been taught all of these things in class i mean i'm doing my gcses right now and we're doing evolution right now and so we've but the things from what i've researched you have homogeny which is what we're taught that similarities are due to common ancestry and to a certain extent you can see that you can see the finches on the galapagos islands sure amazing sure well that's that's one theory because you also have home i think it's homoplasia i'm probably saying it wrong but for example you have there's a sabretooth tiger they're both in north america one is a marsupial one is a placenta they have the exact same the similarities are not due to uh

common ancestry i mean they're not due to common ancestry it's just due to the the kind of development most likely by the environment or whatever it was yeah the theory is based fully on mutations and you cannot show life on earth is not old enough to be as varied as it is and to be successful as successful as it is but tell me can you look the fact that you can see look i'm not talking about the fact that you can see dna no not in theory you can study dna then you'd you don't have to say a tree of life you it doesn't have to be one

common ancestor they some people are just in the bush of life that is why dna is no but that's that's not the problem the problem isn't uh like we're not arguing that this you see at some point it's logical and rational that at some point the entire life spectrum would have had a common ancestor now you could say well i disagree you may have had two different ones so let's say something let's say something landed here from mars now you could argue well simultaneously or in a similar

eon three different sources of life arrived on earth now this is how it began and along the way they kind of mixed up and so it's not really one okay but that's not the point of contention here the point of contention is that evolution of species that we have today on earth we can see how they connect you know this whether you're looking at vestigial um organs whether you're looking at things that we still carry uh animals still how you can see how the whale is actually you know its closest ancestor would trace back to the hippo

uh and you can see this mapped out it's not something you know this isn't no longer just we so either all of this is wrong it's no but still you the assumption is still that the similarities are due to common ancestry even the finches the finch is coming to the not the similarities i'm not talking about how a whale similar to a hippopotamus sorry it's a whale does not you know it's not generally similar to a hippo in that sense like the way the bat is not that similar to a mouse in that sense but we i'm not talking

about the the appearances here yeah i'm talking about the dna the genetic inheritance are you saying that's just still it's not so it's not evident uh again i would bring up the example of the marsupial and the placental saber tooth which are the dna no but the dna there is telling you that they're different okay the marsupial animals their dna does not in fact that is where you got that information from you got it from the scientists telling you that by the way the marsupial line in australia that when it

did or the marsupial tiger when it did exist in australia was not actually related to the tiger and the lion in other places and some of the other animals that do resemble them although they may look like mammals but they weren't related we only get this knowledge through genetics there's nothing else that has taught us that so i'm asking that are you saying that the genetics is false like it's not it's or it's just a total guess like they're just doing but okay then i mean i'm not as

specialized to talk in this discussion then how would you talk how would you explain that when the quran is clearly saying is referring in my understanding to dna um okay yeah i think uh sajid hamid the student of ghandi uh i've sent you the article it's not referring to uh or if you want to take it as actual clay then in that sense it's just a metaphor it's not um you know if you want to take it as a because no

no person generally believes that all of insane like we as in cern generally are from clay like some people might believe adam was made like that but they won't believe in sun generally like we are from clay so if you want to because the because the quran does not say adam yes yeah exactly but in other places it's when it speaks about adam he speaks about him very clearly but in none of these verses about the creation of mankind does it mention adam now that's that's it's it refers to him it implies because it says

and we know that islam no but that's in the that that's in those verses about adam but in the verses about creation creation of mankind humanity beginning like we created you then did this and then set forth many people if those verses come five and there's a sixth variant a time in the quran never does it refer never does it mention adam in them it always just says insane or nas it never says adam although adam is mentioned on many occasions in the quran but never as

humanity having come from adam and i don't the difference is i i don't say that that's coincidental i say that was intentional but yeah that's really interesting and so i had one more topic but i think i might be pushing it right yeah i think there's quite a few people waiting but you know what this was very fascinating i did uh enjoy it and you know this isn't about um you see this is about just learning um it's not you know to me many years ago if you asked me

i did settle at one point with the jamal dean lafrani view that was my understanding and then i started you know learning whatever i could about evolution obviously in psychology as well when we were learning certain things evolutionary psychology when we're looking at other things the more i would learn and the more i understood that okay wow this is the angle because i too didn't understand that the the main uh angle of evolution today or in this day and age is not fossils how people and it's not adaptation it's not you know

humans come from monkeys as in like human they transformed from people yeah yeah no no and it it's not humans did not they they had a common uh ancestor that's the because somebody came on here once and he said i mean that was the person you referred to in the beginning yeah cool but it's been awesome shukran for tuning in much love stay tuned salaam allah

who have we got here several people waiting let me just check humanoids what's this comment coming out the ground remind me of that high production scene what's going on what's this the whole universe is contained within a single human being uh new intellectual says i want to get in well that all depends on what in

what does in me yeah what's this one plumbing i want to talk to you mufti i want to talk yeah i've shared the link what's this plumbing the mind of god [Laughter] i do feel that some of the cheats that god has left in this world for us are in nature and they are these entheogens these psychedelics does mostly not sleep most people where's my thing vampire greetings people i'm a vampire sleep is for the mere mortal um

can you post the link musty i'll post it again yeah there you go i've posted it again right we've got here let's see people waiting there's jawad jawad afraid where are you joining us from yes canada yes i have to i have to remind you every time i'm just joking that's you have to put that down to the the old age yeah if not me then that is very ancient

by now it's uh so ah what's on your your mind was there some comments thoughts question what would you like to share with us yeah i wanted to get your thoughts on this concept so um because i read a lot of like i read a lot of roomie and hafiz and iraqi and stuff with these guys so i was i was these are the real people who read people read learn learn learn from

i'm reading these baby books on on spanish what the hell is this that's the real reading yeah and we have to read the the rap book which rap book was it the one that you show which which one that's when you [ __ ] questions oh yeah that children's book yes it's not going to be here yes but yeah anyway so i when i was reading uh when i was reading them i was seeing um i was reading a common a denominator between all of them and then when i further read um

the philosopher uh ludwig uh wittgenstein uh stein he was epic yeah yeah so he he had a similar like in no way was he religious for sure yeah no but but however he did uh push for our religious outlooks on life so uh he was he was he was um i would say unique in that sense that despite not pushing religion in and of itself he would push a religious outlook on life now my question was i was i wanted to talk to you about the role i was just seeing that shout out rest in

peace to shady yes so yeah so i i wanted to ask what is the what is the role of what would you say is the role of rationality in religion because i do believe rationality has a role in religion for example in the quran allah pushes in many verses when he says for example things like do they not ponder do they not think things like these so i do believe rationality has a role but how what is the role because rationality changes over time because at one point it was rational to believe in some parts of the world that the

earth was flat but today majority of people wouldn't say that's rational so how does how does the rule of rationality change and how does that play into religion because doesn't that mean then the outlook on a certain religious belief changes so would that mean that we're denying parts of religion that's kind of where i was right okay now i mean it's a very good question what i would say jawad is just to let let you know and also the viewers that look i do have a very detailed video on the role of reason within religion

now i tend to go with the term reason being because the definition of reason is the ability for a healthy mind to make judgment especially based on evidence now um damn i think i've got something in my eyes right so now that so when you're looking at evidence yes it will change the judgment at times you will learn certain things that will um you know they may alter your views but generally speaking reason

or rationality is the best we have i understand the two has limitations but it is the best otherwise what else is there that one can go by what if not rationality it is the only common um the kind of the the common judge between affairs otherwise there is nothing like we don't have no common denominator to uh to mediate between diversity we we don't have that apart

from the voice of reason and rationality that is all we have so if you if one removes that then we have nothing because we just have our own experiences which i'm not saying don't mean anything but then they can't really be conveyed to someone because even when i'm conveying my experiences it's from the rationale that you can also share in these experiences yeah then we get into the problem of empiricism versus rationality which was a discussion that used to take place in between philosophers a lot um so when i was

when i to further expand a little bit if we have time so um when i was reading obviously i was talking about a lot of these are known as uh great people within the practice of the subwoofer yes so um one of the things that they push for is um for finding truth through internal like internally coming to a realization of the truth intuitively kind of intuitively and to create that relationship with a creator to submit to the creator like for example

one one interesting understanding of surat al-fatiha that i found by aya sufi from india was that he said that the connection between was that the guidance can only come through full submission to god through allowing god to guide you through experience internal experience and through then using reason true if that makes sense so so i just wanted to ask you what the role of

basically sure i appreciate that i'll watch you click button that's actually a lecture video i have it's an entire lecture called the role of reason within religion and i it was an event i went to some place and i did a whole uh a lecture on it so do if you get time and you're bored and it's locked down and you're thinking what the hell do you check it out yeah but i'll leave the whole audience and you with um a quote from go for it man so he gives wittgenstein he gives a metaphor for how we should use our intellect because

he was he was kind of in line with the sufis when he when he talked about intellect and rationality and he said the power of our intellect and reasoning is like a ladder we should use it to find the right spiritual path but once we climb the ladder we should discard it we should let it go let what go reason we yes okay he would say you would say use reason to get there but once you get there let let it yeah you know because like like and i would say i agree with this but yeah yeah because no i would because like let's say i'm a an

advocate of antigens and things like that now let's say a person was to take a a consciousness trip on one of these these hidden plants within nature you see now that experience that you would have is not rational it's not uh reason based at all it is something inexplicable it is ineffable it it cannot be contained in words it is something without structure without form without words

but it is so real that it is more real than this world that you know so i would agree that you see there comes this certain things that we for ourselves like we will come to realize them by our own experiences that may not be able to be rationalized and that's okay and and i think in fact it's not even about it being okay it's in fact very good those experiences will be perhaps in many ways far above any experience that reason can bring to you but you see

for that to stay safe it's the fortress of reason that kind of keeps that's safe for you and i don't know if this even what i'm saying now makes sense but i but and you know speaking of wittgenstein he has this um amazing um this anecdotal um scene or episode where he's once explaining something and somebody asks him but and he's telling he's kind of making a point about something being true and somebody asks him at one point they

say but but you know they say but is it really true what you're saying you know is this really true and he says he kind of like ponders and he says well it's true enough and and and that is the amazing thing you see because in this world that's the best we're going to get at things that they're just going to really be kind of true enough i feel the more i read books on tutorials and stuff that's what they're kind of preaching that to a certain extent

that you'll you'll find you'll find truths that may be true enough and you leave to a leap of faith in god and and that that's where you sort of just make the leap of faith and just trust that i'm on the correct truth look see seva says it's true enough that it's the only real yeah yeah all right you're doing it for your thoughts much appreciated take very good care of yourself keep doing what you're doing i did what to do on whatsapp so sure all right i'll check it out did you message me okay do if there's

anything do message me all right all right people that's jawad all the way from canada doing it doing it all right who do we have here let me just uh all right we've got freed response but we need the camera pour the camera on man let me oh we've got people over here as well damn i didn't even notice that go on then for either response let's add for its response to the

oh earlier you didn't give me enough time to think of a good question [Laughter] so you've come back through a different channel you know go on then what's what's the question go for it i had a question regarding i hope you haven't answered this one uh it was regarding um sheikh abdullah bin bayer your opinions on him and his father the one he gave about uh israel and the deal between israel and the uae i know you did you did what was uh but what was your what's your opinions on sheikh abdullah

yeah what sorry i just saw this mufti i kiss your eyes what kind of scandal is this [Laughter] this is where i'm getting scandalized but even i don't understand the scandal so sorry coming back to the question what do i uh sheikh abdullah binbaya you see i think sheikh abdullah bin bayer is a great mind he's somebody who's had a lot of courage to come out and condemn terrorism to condemn not just terrorism extremism and to an a a much needed voice for the promotion of

peace so to be able to challenge the you see you've got the likes of the far end like ex terrorists many people will challenge them but then you have this huge cluster of of thought that is still very intolerant extreme um fanatic now most people will not challenge that and he has been a voice that challenges that and i admire i um praise that and i think it's much needed however i do feel that you see with this

these are my thoughts on sheikh abdullah bin bayer i feel that um maybe this is his what he wants of course so what i'm about to say it may not be you know it may be by design so i don't know whether this is by design or whether it's um just happens to be that way i feel that he's kind of missed an entire train like he missed the boat on certain great things that he could have done so it may be that then this maybe just acts it wasn't prioritized

he didn't really he wasn't bothered it could have been that oh he was bothered but it wasn't really at the top of his to-do list or it could have been that no he designed it that way and that is that he doesn't really have a connect with people on the ground and he doesn't have a um like he it's as though his thing is not about grassroots and he's not really con like he doesn't appear to really you know invest much effort in that either in

and even the imams or the scholars he's not really interested in connecting with people or i mean he's interested in the conference connecting but that i'm sep you see i'm separating that from the common from the normal world because do you disagree with uh scholars getting involved in politics like him you see it's not getting involved in politics that was bad uh because i think some people have to because obviously you can't um it may not be everybody's cup of tea but i don't think that's necessarily wrong getting involved in politics

i just feel it's a shame that he doesn't so for example he's really huge let me materially concretize it so it makes sense because what i'm saying may not make sense to people um so let's give a positive example like he spoke out about the caliphate being a myth now he did that outright and that was a you know it was a tsunami because when he did it youssef did it and so it was like wow shook the foundations of many people and it did great things so he's prepared to do that so he's prepared to take on

extremely radical points of view when you think about it that is not something minor that's huge so there's other views as well so for example he's been asked um about can the sharia change and i've read articles online that he has said at conferences that the sharia can change the sharia can and this is the view of many maliki's i've done you know kind of points on it imam burzuli and all these things and i've mentioned it i've got videos on it so he said that at a conference so for example and it's all over if you google it it comes straight up that you know

sherpin bayer said that these laws need to change they're outdated the sharia allows it but now he won't for example um do videos or something for the general public to explain this he will do it only at a state level and and i feel that the problem with stuff like that like he's really big on muslim on makkah really big but yet makassid requires several fatal like makasid is a theory

it's a grand theory it's like it's a tool so it's like saying you know there's a particular tool in this toolbox but people want to see products they want to see what the tool can make it's like saying i've got a 3d printer but what does it make so muscle would mean let's say oh the sharia changes okay he said something in in a conference somewhere but every day fertawa now he won't issue even though i'm sure he does issue them privately but he doesn't he doesn't make that public for the public he's not going to help the person on the ground with that ruling that is true you don't hear much from him apart from through here comes the use of maybe here

and there yeah and i and as an example i met him uh several years ago and i remember once saying to him look um would you like i asked him something as an example let's say ramadan daylight and it was that the days were incredibly lengthy here and and this was when the topic was hot and fresh so about five years ago six years six years ago seven years ago so i said to him you know there's all these hadith that mention the um that many of the companions used to eat into

the dawn but so long as it was before sunrise now i said look you've got precedent you've got um you've got hadith you've got uh the muslim you've got the strange time that we're going through the twilight period i said would you you know give this fatwa now okay fair enough he won't give the fatwa but he won't like this would be an issue that he won't really even discuss or even go into even though it's an issue that concerns people it concerns so many people do you reckon some scholars they won't say anything because they find something controversial exactly that this

this is my point so a lot of people like otherwise they can't they get questions my point is if you're gonna only be but think about the khilafah thing is an atom bomb yeah but just because you see then what people are going to see is that you're only you're prepared to take on controversy but if governments ask you to do it because you see the way the people then see is oh because the uae king has asked you to do this you've done it you've taken you know that's a huge atom bomb to say there was never a khilafah i think that's way more controversial than saying you can eat into dawn

but you see here this issue doesn't like well no king is going to ask you to say this you know no government really cares whether you say you can eat this or do this so this if you're going to do it purely for the public so when there's a disconnect that you do things that are huge but only when they're linked with the government now i'm not saying his intentions are bad it may be that he sees them as more important but this is how the world will see it then the world will see that you know you don't when it's come when it's to do with the common muslim on the ground

you don't really issue any fatah of ease you're not really involved okay maybe random one-off like he even if you think about it his fatawa i think to do with saying christmas and all of this they were i think when he was part of a a fatwa forum that i think it was the european fatwa whatever but even that like he there hasn't really been a video or anything to explain it and i don't know whether he actually people might say well he doesn't do videos anyway much but uh but yeah so that's my only my thought that i feel he is there's a huge

not a huge there is the overwhelming impression is he's disconnected from people and then there's an impression that he is he just he's just working for the government of the uae because that's the only time he's seen to do something that's so amazing is whenever the government wants it and and like i said in the beginning i don't i'm not saying that that's whether that's by design it could be that he it is by design and he's just prioritized it it could be that he's just not got round to doing these things but it's a shame that's that's what it is

cool man i think we better yeah no take care much love our very interesting um question there so all right who else have we got here we've got uh quran centric believer allah let me just somebody said yo mufti yo mufti yo what's going on i found you some i found you some murids bring them right on man

bring them right on where is the link here's the link see people there's the link all right quran centric believer i think yep i think you've got something basically all right where where where are you joining us from and what's your name still getting hungry i'll tell you what i'll come back i'll come back to you if you want i'll come

back to you don't i'll i'll i'll come back to you you can if you want finish your meeting okay i think you've got something uh or lovely i think you've got something okay okay so i i wasn't a i was a quranist so i'm you you might remember like with edwixel you had that debate oh yes i mean it was a discussion it wasn't really a debate but yeah discussion the discussion yeah yeah and then with jake franken allah and he brought his so basically jake i've been studying more and more the issue of the

sunnah and the validity and so on and so forth [Music] and i've been finding like as i'm finding more like maybe this like tradition does make some sense like the prayers the fasting ramadan and this whole in coronism everyone's basically like debating and everyone like no one no one agrees even what salah means some say it's two prayers three five births something this can't be like maybe there is a validity to this one huh so do you have maybe any points for someone

who's doubting that some some points of why you believe it's valid from a chronic standpoint and specifically with regard to verse in chapter five yeah the sunnah and um chapter 5 verse 48 it talks about um we sent to you the book um and then it it tells the prophet and it says judge by what god has sent down so the argument is well the prophet only judged with the quran

based on this verse what was your response to that okay so all right now you see no no the so two questions there first of all this uh verse that [ __ ] is it the one [ __ ] being on bill no no this is the

it talks about uh we sent down the book something like probably something like that okay sure but anyway i mean nevertheless i mean the um the the meaning uh is the same thing that you're you're saying i mean we've understood the gist of i'm not sure exactly which verse you're saying but i'll i can try and bring what verse did you say basically the the uh chapter 5 verse 48 5.

okay and the argument is well he only he was only allowed to judge with the quran based on this verse that's the argument like what do you say to that right okay considering the traditional perspective like i'm open-minded to the okay so

but then i don't i don't understand like this so so okay so this particular surah maidah verse 48 and he says and we have sent down to you um this scripture we have sent down this revelation yeah rightfully it really it kind of validates that which went before it from scripture or from kitab here let's say if it means revelation or scripture because obviously it doesn't mean an actual physical book what muhammad and it is something that will supersedes

that which went before right right yeah and judge by them or rule between them or over them with what god has revealed right okay so uh and do not fall into temptations or desires and this is what it's

do not fall into temptation or desires to that which will lead you away from the revelation of god yeah right and then allah says and we have made a different kind of narrative and scripture for different uh you know nations amongst you so okay so i don't see how that is uh so when god says basically that um follow what god has revealed or judged by what god has revealed

i don't think what what that means is because just to be clear nobody is denying the status of the quran as a muslim nobody is saying that what god has ruled in the quran should not be judged by what people are saying can there be other matters in which people can have other rulings or have other so the quran obviously gives an overview it doesn't give every single thing it's not going to go into it or are you going to say no it does give every single thing in the sentence you see see what where i why i where i'm coming from is i've realized that

some things are just taken as axiomatic like for example in chapter 62 verse 9 it says oh you who believe when the call is made to the salah on the day of congregation haste into the room to the remembrance of god right and leave off all trade or all selling i mean it doesn't say you know on a specific day there's going to be this some with it like it it's already being done you know it's already yeah yeah because nobody is nobody is arguing against the quran as a muslim what they're saying is there will be other matters so for example if

you have that verse which i was saying earlier on that uh obey allah obey his messenger and the people who are have some authority amongst you for international but if you disagree in something you've had a dispute in matters right yeah what do you return it to rasool so bring it back to allah and his messenger obviously it doesn't just say allah

because there may be matters which allah hasn't uh you know that they they've not they're not in the quran or they've not been legislated or there is leeway in like sometimes it's not black and white you can have certain matters it's like the hadith let's say with the prophet he gives a person something and then the person's overly critical of the prophet and the prophet says you know what well actually by default you are you only deserve this much so you know what that we're going to take that back you can only have what you deserved what i gave you was extra now

the so i i mean i'm not sure so okay coming to the other point of the question the point is like the judgment i guess like the whole point like for example like one could say okay well the salah and the practices the zakah and all that that was all like taught by him but when it comes to like judging a matter we can all only go to the quran if you like i don't know like i guess sunnis don't so like you the first like that so am i doing it in a too restrictive way or what do you think no that particular verse is speaking about prior revelation isn't it

it's trying to say that look they have been there has been revelation before this supersedes it follow revelation do not follow temptation it's not in like to me that's not trying to say that by the way you will have other rules amongst you as a civilization that are not necessarily you'll still rule by them as well so for example would you not have road traffic uh laws would you not have uh um like what i don't understand what like it's not trying to say that humanity will only have these laws that are now highlighted in the quran you'll never have any other laws

of course you'll you'll have plenty of laws and rules and how to set up corporations and how does a person i don't know you have so many things that are in law they're not all obviously they they they shouldn't go against the spirit of the quran but it doesn't mean that they will all be in the quran like should you open a window looking out into your garden what if you can look into the neighbor's garden i mean how does so all of these kind of rules that you have so when the prophet salallahu in sahih muslim this hadith about the prophet trying to say leave a certain amount you know when

you're building your wall and a house there should be so many arm spans of a pathway so in case people want to pass through with you know on on horses and things there should be a certain distance to the pathway in between the alleyway it shouldn't be too narrow now the quran's not going to say things like that because it's not going to really get into such finite kind of detail on how social customs and conventions and rules but it doesn't mean you can't have them i think it'd be very primitive to assume that societies can't have rules and laws

so do you um do you believe that the sunnah is revelation what what what does that mean um so okay so my understanding argument is that basically my my understanding is that the sharia referring to the legal aspect yeah the that's in case some sometimes i know some people by the term sharia i have a different definition so when i'm saying sharia i mean the legal aspect laws in and of themselves

are not necessarily holy they are social they are a social remedy for the social solutions of the time it's just the vehicle in which they were delivered in this case uh the quran that was sacred it was not the law that was sacred so otherwise the previous civilizations wouldn't have gone against it it wasn't like allah in that same verse says

they had different laws so the fact that you shouldn't drink alcohol they were allowed to drink alcohol so it wasn't that this alcohol not drinking thing is so sacred that god forgot about it before and then remembered these are just laws for different times that people will have they the laws of the sharia if you take the quran every single law within the quran was a custom that was already in existence somewhere in that region the arabs like so for example the quran may have modified certain parts that it felt were oppressive but it didn't introduce it

from scratch it didn't kind of come up with a um a kind of concept that the arabs totally was alien to them it didn't do that at all ever like so so i mean i'm not sure when you're saying do i feel that this is revelation is that what you mean do i feel that it is sacred we don't have to get into like the whole debate like sharium like changing over time because i don't really agree with that but sure i it's more about the whole uh but it makes a is you see but yeah because the question i think

in essence is the same i think when you're asking is sunnah revelation you're asking the rulings that the prophet gave through hadith are they sacrosanct is this this is i take it what it brings down to is it is it do those things apply to us so you broke up are they people will say well um but when you say are they revelatory what you see because when you're saying are they revelatory are they it does come down to this thing are they in and of themselves sacred

well that's what i've read like the standard sunni argument says so let's say let's say let's say let's say as an example to shave unwanted hair okay is this a sacred act is it according to you well there's nothing on it in the quran so i mean i wouldn't really i wouldn't so okay i'll tell you what let's let's take a ruling up from the quran okay so so if if we if we're going to say something

um allah says about if you're going to either if you're bor taking a loan have witnesses is this a sacred holy act that you feel that this is somehow does this act is it sacred this law that god has said judgment from god so we should follow it no i never said that i asked the question was obviously it's in the quran it's from god but i'm asking is it holy we can't change it like what's so special about that law apart from the fact that it's in the quran but what is there something

in and of that law itself that is very holy i don't know it's ju i just know that god okay okay is it yeah but would what i'm trying to ask is would would would could people come would people come up with that law anyway is god introducing this or were people doing this anyway and god is just reminding them that do it this way i mean or is this something introduced so no let me get this right so no humanity had never known of having witnesses when taking loans god introduced it in the quran by saying

hey humanity when you take a loan no it is relevant because you see because it then touches on the ontology the ontological nature of revelation because you're asking about revelation now here we can see the nature of revelation in this particular ruling so this particular ruling is it sacred first of all first of all must you even do it so do you if you were to take if you were to take a loan and you did not have a witness are you sinful

probably i mean i should have obeyed i believe that you should obey that that rule i do believe so so is is this is like an act of worship is it to take a witness it's a ruling from god it's a ruling no i never said it's not a hearing from god i'm asking i'm not asking is it i know it's a ruling it's in the quran the the point is that is it is this an act of worship is it holy is it an act of worship to take a witness so let's say let's say i was uh you were messaging me tonight or i was messaging you i would say sorry sorry i didn't catch your name earlier on what was your name

timor timor timo timo okay so timu let's say i i'd message you i said hey timo you know have you got uh 500 pounds on you you could borrow me so you say yeah no problem here i'll paypal it to you or whatever or here i'll send it over to a transfer so let's say or you had asked a friend now nobody had witnessed that let's say you're on the phone doing it it wasn't in text messages you're on the phone and i said look hey could you could you lend me you know a 500 pound i say yeah sure no problem i'll go into my bank and i'll just make a transfer to you now you never got a witness whilst you

did it i never got a witness whilst i said it and we never let's say we never wrote it um now is this are we sinful in the eyes of god probably because sin is transgression of the law right so i mean now so i uh you tell me are we sinful obviously i'm going to say of course we're not but so so i mean i mean i mean i don't want to go on to the the uh tangent really but i i believe that you know if if we do have a command we should follow it it's it's not like we could say like oh

you know it says this but let's just do it differently because we're in a different time i don't i don't follow okay but but okay so now is this this is a famous verse of the quran it is the longest verse in the entire quran right now right is you must write it down right must we write it down what if you know i mean let's say we never like in that particular example i just asked you over the phone it doesn't actually say that but it would say that sorry

uh let me bring up the actual verse and we could go through the just from myself right so uh and let this person write it amongst you with justice and then it goes on because this is the longest verses i mentioned

then it goes on about whether the men you know two witnesses whether this right men and if not then what let them be two women instead of one man and so on now in this particular verse writing it down or having witnesses over it i scholars let me just tell you scholars do not believe generally speaking that that is uh mandatory okay they say this is this is for safeguarding yeah allah is mentioning this he's highlighting that this is how it should be done because these are matters that often become disputes so to keep a record

is there to prevent disputes so what the fukaha say is my youth be elena that which is highly likely to end up as a dispute you should have witnesses over it and you should have documentation you have records so when you get to that stage you can say look here's the record it's not to do with worship it's not a a worship related act it's not sacred or holy just because allah is revealed in the quran this is and this is good practice that's what it is because why is it good practice because it's going to save you a headache later on

many of you and and and not just a headache it could turn into an actual fight it could turn into bloodshed you know you could say well where's my money and i could say well what money you never even gave me money and now so so this is and the same thing with mark sorry that's why yeah right but you don't need it but it would prevent the dispute later on allah says you know write it even if we didn't write it but the point is these are rules that were taken from society it's not like the arabs didn't know about witnesses they used to do that anyway but some people

didn't do it and the point is allah is pointing out that take this route you know if you've got a chance take this it will you know it's it may be a bit more of a headache but it will prevent dispute later on so it's not so when i say to you the act of writing down a debt is that you know it's revelation but it's not sacred it's not a sacred it's just it's common sense of the time that is being told that adopt this common sense make it practice so when you on so if we accept that point now in light of that what would you like

to ask about the sun now so i mean i don't really agree on that point but i know but so so so so okay let's let's go to that point then so let's say a person no because it is an important point so let's say if if if it was sacred then disobedience is a sin a sin according to do you believe a sin is punishable by hell fire

not one not necessarily it's up to god to decide no it's up to god to forgive but let's say he doesn't forgive is it does is the act punishable so so let's might go on your scale of bad deeds maybe go on your scale or something so which which is about punishment isn't it that's what the scale of bad news is about so so the point is that for not having written down a debt right god would throw you in the hellfire potentially to say well why on earth did you not write down no

no because it's not it's done of course not i don't know no but but of course not that that would be uh you know that's not what the verse is talking about we could make that argument about all all like smaller things we could make that argument about so many things you know no that's because it is that way that's exactly what it is that the rules in the quran were just rules that the arabs already had okay some people were practicing so for example if it says um for a zina lash them with a hundred lashes

or cutting the hand of the thief do you think that that's we shouldn't follow that so i have a detailed video on trajectory hermeneutics now the malakia many of them had the understanding that like i've mentioned the laws were from that day and age as the dna changed the laws would change because they would reflect the day and age the laws weren't holy so for example whipping someone is not a holy act per se it's obviously something islam didn't invent whipping people people were whipping people from you know from time immemorial so islam did not

invent it god didn't reveal it as in oh my god before that we had no idea we could whip people so as the dna changed and as you know punishments change and society changes you would change the law would change doesn't even that verse that we talked about before the you know who's better than god for people who know like who's better as than god as a judge for people who know you know right what verse are we talking about i think it's the same somewhere in that passage right it's the whole thing is like from chuck yeah but the point here is that that chapter

i mean that whole verse is talking about previous revelation and it's saying that this has come in and it's supersedes it and god knows best because people would say well why has it superseded it so allah is saying that he knows best nobody is denying that nobody's challenging that revelation when it came down when it came down this was for that society that it came to with those laws in seventh century arabia this would have if you said to them something else it wouldn't have made sense to them

if you said to them the way we have laws today that wouldn't have made sense to those people it would have been a totally new concept to them but i mean because i mean we can agree to this we're in that point sure this point about sunnah and stuff so for example the five daily prayers right the fact that there are five prayers right for example it's not i mean people can this can debate about about it i don't think it's like explicitly in the quran right like it doesn't say you need to do it etc right this

that is not in the quran people would argue that's revelation from the sunnah what do you think is revelation that was given to the prophet as part of the sunnah or what what category of information is that is is the salah are we talking about um are we talking do you just to ask you i don't know do you accept do you i don't do you accept salah first of all maybe you don't accept salah do you accept salah i do believe it's a ritual okay sure sure okay so you know the salah do you

that do you i don't know where you stand on this but uh i don't think it's not a matter of opinion but anyway uh if you are aware that salah the arabs already had salah you do understand that they had not not just the not the word they used to worship in a similar rish obviously the salah in islam over time got modified but the the kind of skeletal the skeleton of it was already there the arabs used to so when the prophet was praying in mecca they they knew what he that he was praying

they didn't think like so for example if you turned up to alaska or you turned up to the i don't know the north pole and these people have never seen somebody pray before in their lives and you start you go into raku now those people wouldn't know what you're doing like they would probably think is he trying to look for something is he what is he that was not the reaction of quraish the quraish looking at the prophet weren't thinking oh is he looking for something on the ground is he lying down on the floor is he finding something they knew he was praying they knew they had salah they weren't this was not something new that the prophet invented but

they they already had salah so yes so yes so it was modified no so it was modified over time i i i agree with that so for example we we recite the quran in it they may have glorified hubble and and these things other kind of deities latin or zain and stuff like that so obviously the the formation of it it got modified i'm not denying that it was modified but i'm saying that the skeleton of it was did exist it wasn't introduced

from scratch it wasn't something which the example i gave off turning up in the north pole and doing it it wasn't like that at all they knew exactly the profit in the beginning in the early days it looked very similar to what they were doing later on it got modified like where they placed the hands got modified how many rakaat got maybe modified stuff like this but in the beginning it would have been very similar we get modified so as much information would it get right okay so here we know that the prophet sallam showed that this is how you pray

i take it the question you're asking is would the prophet have a a license to legislate independently now this is something to legislate but like um because yes so the general argument is that debris showed him through revelation right it doesn't whether we whether whether whether he did or not but this is an usuli debate which i have spoken of in the past and i do agree with i agree with all the there's been several maliki's imam jawani has it in his book other people have it in the subki all these people will discuss it in usual

that is the prophet asharya is he also somebody that comes with shalia so and so people disagree on it i would go with the understanding that yes if the prophet was to legislate uh he too would legislate he would come up with certain rulings he would say things so the su lien right um they say um and yeah that nabi has the the the authority uh that he can give a ruling or do something whatever he does that will then be deemed

the truth as in sorry correct as in religiously correct so in the hadith when the prophet saws that came up here so it would be hard uh i mean it depends what you mean by that but yes it would be part of islam it would be part of the the religion however you view it so you may so for example people viewed it in different categories so sometimes some of the iraqi in viewed anything the sunnah brings can never be mandatory can never be haram it can only be recommended or discouraged uh some people viewed it in different

so i'm not saying how do you when you say binding that's only speaking of mandatory people don't pray five times are you saying people don't have to pray no i never said that i'm saying that you're asking me that the number five praise for example this is something the prophet showed i agree the prophet showed that it's not clearly in the quran i know people try to show it i think in the quran it's not yeah sure but i i think you can find like what the quran shows are like kind of like traces and the substance is really in the sunnah and it's the living tradition that was

inherited from the prophet similarly the hajj thing and other things as well you will see i agree so when the prophet is demonstrating because he was obviously living amongst people he would be you know for many for over two decades he's living there as a prophet so he's dealing with matters he's showing things when he's acting out and exemplifying these rulings that or um that kind of life that he's breathing into these things is that does he have a license

to create things so i am with those who lean those scholars that say the prophet has a license to create and and and for example the hadith where he is asked that is uh do we do hajj every year and he says if i was to say yes i you know it would become obligatory or in the other rulings where they say to the prophet where he's describing a parameter that is sacred and then somebody says but we need this particular tree and then the prophet says okay that's an exception and he's making

an exception there and then in real time and this is because this is because it comes back to that argument that uh or and the explanation i gave in the beginning that rulings are just social remedies to social solutions they're not sacred in and of themselves so are the five this is why is the number five sacred so no it's not about the number five being sacred but salah is so salah is an act of worship yeah now it is a ritual it is entirely a ritual from a to zed it is not a kind of it like when i spoke

about having a witness for a debt that was nothing there was nothing sacred about that it was there was nothing worship related about it it was just human transactions and it was just telling you how to adopt a sensible approach to prevent disputes further on now that you you can you know you can turn away from it you can come up with your own versions you can come up with today contracts different contracts 28 day clauses you can do all of this it's got there's a license to it now when there is a pure ritual that is there so allah is saying do the hajj

or do salah let's say salah is a perfect example salah existed before uh the the form kind of in its raw form existed before islam came but now the prophet is setting out he's delineating that this will now be the salah for muslims we will do it with this many raqqa we will do it with and he has this license to do it so now what he does it's not real no so it's just dispensation essentially it's a dispensary no no no so these are not roxas this these are the prophet showing you

now if you're saying where is he learning it from is this what you're asking are you asking where is the prophet learning this from so this obviously now we're not in the mind of the prophet many people here would disagree some people would say that he's learning this from uh from revelation they would say that intuitive revelation is coming to him other people may argue that he is shaping this out he knows that you have to pray and he can modify because he has this

license to create he can do it he's doing it creatively he's doing it it's not a form of uh revelation coming to him so are you but it's okay so some people no i'm not saying that i'm saying some people would say that but the point we don't know because the prophet doesn't explain it what we know is he shows us this is the salah now okay he says that this is it we know allah says pray and he says this is it now did every single aspect within that salah come to the prophet in some kind of revelation did he create

some of it adapt some of it uh like so for example there's a hadith that um somebody some companion said robert and and the prophet said you know that's an amazing thing that such and such has said and we should say sorry he added to it uh to the and then the prophet said that's a good thing we should add that in salah now here he is likely like the azan for example the prophet is saying to the people how should we do the athan and they're coming up with ideas they're saying we should you know ring bells and we should do stuff and and then they're saying well oh the prophet sees this dream and

they're doing this but then people say uh you know hey allah ah sorry assalato in a gnome was this not so there's a whole debate about this was added it was not actually from the original athan now jake said remember you had jake brancatella on and then you had edible excel and jake kind of talked about this like wahi the the just the whole saying that the prophet muhammad got revelation other than the quran and that was his main argument against the quran no i've you see i'm telling you that i i i can't recall exactly edith's point on it or

jake's but i'm telling you i've said i've said here that look salah is a perfect example salah existed before islam came allah says they had a salah like i've told you that the prophet was not like a person praying in front of i don't know eskimos who have no idea what he's doing they knew exactly what he's doing they knew he's praying but he's just praying to the one god as opposed to their gods so it's it's not he didn't come with something that was alien to the people

it was very indigenous the prayers were indigenous the fasts were indigenous the hajj was indigenous everything was indigenous he didn't introduce something from like the indian culture to arabia he didn't introduce something chinese it was all arab and he kept the arab so the it's not now the salah existed the prophet modified it and he made changes and he structured it so he over time over 20 years it changed so it didn't begin that way i'm sure in the beginning it was very similar to this except he just didn't do the silky things he didn't worship he didn't

praise hubble and a lot and so on now over years he starts to change it so you have hadith that talking is now forbidden they could talk you have certain hadith about they stopped flapping their hands they used to do something with their hands i'm not exactly sure what but it mentions in bukhari the certain hadith that they stop doing they say that don't do that anymore now there's certain practices that they change these changes where is the prophet bringing them from is it i said that the scholars this would disagree some people would feel that this is revelation now we know it's not in the quran

so it would be some kind of intuitive revelation that god is giving him some scholars may feel that he had a creative license as a prophet he could fashion and shape the salah he was just told you've got to do a salah he has this prophetic license i don't feel necessarily either is a problem i don't feel whether he had a license to shape certain things which i do believe in other matters he definitely had a license or to do it so and we see that in the things like where he's saying if i was to say yes it would become mandatory

in the hajj parameter he had a license now did he have a license in salah i don't know all i know is that this was the salah that we inherited from him whether it was by prophetic license some of it was fashioned or whether the whole thing was fashioned just by god alone i guess we'll never really know but that but scholars would be divided on it yes so you're okay so you're basically it's not we don't know if it's revelation or not because that was like jake's main point like he got other revel no look listen you don't look you you only know the quran came from the prophet

you don't know anything other than that you the link between the prophet and god you don't know that that's just faith isn't it sure like you can only trace things back up to the prophet muhammad sallallahu alaihi sallam nobody can trace things pro you can't trace it to god how can you trace it to god show me how you trace it to god how do you complain they claim it's like all revelation and stuff so no so no i'm asking you so it's no so it's faith isn't it it's not you can't trace it so when you say look uh this is from god that's obviously an understanding that you've applied based

on a faith that this is coming from god otherwise all you know is that this is what the prophet gave us he gave us the quran you you don't obviously you don't know you weren't strengthening the quran no not at all because i'm telling you that everything came to you from the prophet muhammad sallallahu alaihi sallam and now it's binding that's your point basically so it came from him no we're not talking about binding binding means it's compulsory and mandatory i'm not saying it was mandatory i'm saying to you that it came from the prophet muhamm now a whole life came from him

sure he obviously wasn't just somebody that disappeared after 60 seconds he lived an entire life amongst people so now in the quran it said things and he lived them and you only inherited what he taught you didn't inherit it you couldn't bypass the prophet you can't go from us to god you only your final stop is with the prophet and and then it's his word that this is how it is so the prophet is saying well this is the salah now the question is well okay now the rest is our interpretation scholars have kind of looked at it and said well generally the sharia

did the prophet have prophetic license or not and it's a debate like some people would say yes he did can i just uh just so we don't run out uh yeah i think this has gone up quite a bit the the license and stuff i just want to ask you real quick the the main point with the salah is like for example quranis will say that if you mention muhammad for example in the shahadah you have muhammad or you say like the salam or the tashahud basically they say this is shirk because you're addressing let me let me ask you something let me ask you something yeah all right any detail you have of

islam today of early islam of so for example where the the fact that the prophet was in medina have you had anything about the prophet that you have as information today only came down through reports it did not come in the quran the quran doesn't even explain exactly where the prophet was yes so no but your belief so do you believe something about the prophet do you believe he lived in arabia for example you don't know no see i i don't do you believe the prophet was an arab for example see i don't i believe that we can like

ascertain certain things i'm but i'm saying like for example no something i don't understand what the like look if you take islam 95 i don't know if even more than that but you're on the understanding of the narrative of islam as you as we have it is really through the reports whether some now there's going to be a lot of falsehood there's going to be a lot of manipulation i get all of that but the story you have of islam the story that you actually have like when you said oh well the prophet did this the fact that the prophet lived in mecca this

story that you have you didn't get that from the quran the quran never told you the prophet lived in makkah you you you the quran never told you the prophet lived in madina the quran never told you the prophet lived for 22 years as a prophet no it doesn't yeah but yatrip being madina who told you yesterday was medina you now the point is that you see what like you the overall understanding you have of almost anything of islam today has really come down through the living tradition now you i i get the fact that things would creep in and things would be

distorted and things would but to say you see the the challenge with just the quran like if you take the quran in itself is actually quite very enigmatic like today you've seen the whole makkah question that people have presented yeah the petra thing yeah the whole thing the reason why they can present these things because they even say the quran is actually a book that if you take it it doesn't actually it doesn't clarify anything about its positioning like apart from speaking about god and saying believe in god don't believe in false idols and some rulings it's kind of like free floating it could be anyway like you

could take the quran and place it in china and just say look this is what is referring to like it's it's not unlike the bible which goes through complete geographical like everything it tells you everything in detail the quran doesn't mention anything like that i think it mentions the name of maybe nine locations or something it doesn't mention otherwise anything it's just even the stories are so kind of um enigmatically expressed and in such a short way that you could superimpose them on different stories it's not um you know it's not that difficult even the chronology of prophets is not clear

in the quran which prophet comes before which maybe with one or two you could say okay but the others it's not clear that you know was this prophet before this prophet was he after it's not actually clear the quran doesn't so this is why even these orientalists could do can you know they can ask these questions because the quran alone it doesn't lock into a kind of gps its positioning is is very enigmatic so i look i'm not saying to people that they need to follow uh the the kind of like the hadith is thing or they need to do this i myself

i'm against uh dogmatism hadith dogmatism sure but i would say people who adhere to this argument of any narratives let's let's kind of this all narratives should be dissipated any narrative and we should just have scripture no i don't follow that thinking i do think that we should learn like from and like take into account the tradition and like look into it what would your what would you be like your message be for someone for example who's thinking about becoming more of a traditionalist coming from a quranis background or quran

i i would just say look just ponder over this what i've just said that the the whole message of islam as you've understood it has really just has not come to you in the quran the the over like yes the quran has the the core message of one god and that this world is not the end of that is the these are the core messages within the quran that are repeated so often and it has this message that there is revelation and prophets have come before and and civilizations have been before and collapsed that message exists in the quran and here and there there's some rules that have been mentioned obviously

the overwhelming narrative of the quran is not rules and laws like people say there's 500 verses of this 6 600 verses in the quran that's a tiny fraction so yes the bulk of anything we understand about islam whether it's the life of the prophet how revelation was coming down what were the stories what were this what was that any narrative we've got of islam has come to us through these reports now i get the fact that we can be cynical and we can be skeptical and we have to kind of things have to make sense but to me to say well you know okay

because a b and c doesn't make sense let's throw everything away to me what it leaves you with lacks any kind of depth and it lacks any true flavor like you're kind of neither here neither there you the arena that's yeah that that's definitely noticing with with quranists is like you know people don't agree on sallah is people don't agree on what ramadan is two prayers three prayers five prayers zac this suck as that there's too much like disagreement then when i look at like traditionalism it's like

the disagreements are about like in a very narrow scale like well yeah no i agree and it's not to me look it's not you know if a person wants to pray females if he feels he's only three and he prays three or you feel you know it's not really uh you know to me it's not to me it's the overall message of islam that is lost in the life of the prophet and everything the prophet completely disappears the moment you say like you know nothing about him then all of a sudden because everything is then suspect and you know this somebody said look the quran mentions that the prophet is arab it doesn't

mention necessarily the prophet it does say that he this is an arabic quran right now but we if the prophet could have been so for example uh i don't know if today you will consider those northern arabs as arabs but they were arabs as well uh what's to say that the prophet wasn't somebody that for example knew arabic but wasn't an arab i'm just saying going by the quran it doesn't mention that it just mentions that this is this is a clear arabic quran and it only mentions the word makkah once when they're going on hajj it mentions the word makkah otherwise it doesn't it never mentions the word

makkah and it does not and when it speaks about yatrib it does not yep sorry you've gone silent yeah okay can i just get a quick comment uh just because this is like the biggest thing about like traditional versus quran alone which is kind of keeping me in the middle is for example the claim of like eddie buxell and other people that claim that for example if in the if you add muhammad's name or if you do the atahiyatu and the salawat on the

on the prophet and so on and especially the like you know the son you know you give the salam to the prophet in the prayer hello do you know what i'm talking about uh sorry you kind of like uh i lost you there for a while but you're just saying that if you say that

if you're adding muhammad's name or or asking god to send salawat or especially the like were you doing the salam directly in the second person like alaika to the prophet they say this is shook what do you think i mean that's i i don't need to think about it it's dumb obviously it's stupid isn't it like this whole thing is look it doesn't really require an explanation i i find the unnecessary extremism that some of these people have it makes zero sense to me it's such a fanatic viewpoint i this

viewpoint of calling people kafir and calling people you know mushriks and calling people all of this stuff i find it very like obviously antithetical to the message of islam so yeah i mean if you know if you address the prophet obviously the prophet isn't here but if i was to say yeah muhammad you know if people were like they say they write on things yeah muhammad or yanabi or ya rasulullah

it may not mean what you think it means but it's not [ __ ] cool let's wrap this okay uh because it's because he's not god right so i'm surprised that even requires an explanation there's only one god it's as simple as that okay cool let's wrap this up it's been for uh we did go on quite a while there whoa i got distracted there ah right so people let's i know there's been quite a few people waiting let's try and keep them a bit short now um bob the builder saying something

um or disagree on things until the end of time i'm sure we will i want uh 50 minutes with musty too mario you're a legend okay your religion magic i don't know what that's talking about but right god let's bring in someone else where are you joining us from i'm joining you from bangalore india

you're doing it so what's going on what yeah no it's been great session uh you know uh being uh a lot of questions were answered but uh i wanted to hear your thoughts about a couple of things now when we take this one particular ayah that says one who purifies his soul is the one you know that will be successful or uh he'll be the one that prevails right [Music] purity of self and soul right now uh when

we take this concept of purifying self now the question is we don't know what it is like how do you differentiate between this is me and this is not me because uh everything around us is a social construct right uh the things that will learn uh the traditions the rituals so uh what we're thinking is okay we can't really differentiate between um you know uh what it is that we are

versus um uh you know basically what's not me and when we dive deep into it a little bit to try and understand who we are there's a couple of things right so uh in your modern sciences or yogic sciences you've got consciousness awareness you know uh understanding your existence and things like that so there's two things um

you see that's what these things are simply in my understanding talking about that you see these things are talking about to me the soul okay which is consciousness which is then which ties in with also your uh to a lower extent to your conscience as well and morality but you see you by refining these things are becoming a better human being and that is true success you know that and that that is a person that has then

attained true success by becoming it would ultimately its manifestation would mean that you've become a better human being somebody who cares more somebody who's more compassionate has a higher understanding of humanity that's what it would mean but you could take the understanding of uh being blissful in the afterlife as well so both it it you know it gives that both both perspectives so when we look at it uh now in terms of our deen and worship our goal is to attend isan in the way we worship right and uh

so when it comes to purification of self now uh here's my question really we got two concepts one is um the well-known tasa wolf and if we look at history which predates islam we've got yogic sciences right so when you dig deep into vedas and upanishads and things like that and that has a detailed breakdown of uh you know what our human properties are in terms of breaking down your consciousness your state of um existence you know

and conscience as a property of you uh but not exactly you you see what i mean and uh in a sting i feel like i need to take some mushrooms to understand this conversation [Laughter] when we look at it in terms of seriously connecting with ourselves understanding uh who we are as a creation and um you know unifying ourselves uh to be able to connect with the creator

right from mysticism point of view right without crossing the line of um you know going out of dean and uh you know you know grasping the roots of zika and trying to concentrate and being able to achieve that state of mind uh to say that uh okay you know uh you are in a deep meditative state where you're you have clarity about yourself and um then what we could do is we evaluate ourselves into okay these are the things that are not me which i need to purify

and attain hasan in the way i live my life if if i've understood your question i think what you're saying is that can we use other methods of uh you know like how you've got the the yogic and you've got these other kind of meditative practices to heighten consciousness and is that also a kind of tuskia does that still fit this verse i i would say look sure anything that if it's meditation if it's for some people having um you know some other practices if it's for some people anything that can bring you

to a more pure of a refined self a better you is is welcome i i feel that look the quran doesn't explain it does say it it says you know about uh and these kind of things uh but it doesn't mention how to do the task gear now it i mean some people may say well it gives some indications about doing thicker of online stuff of course but my point is it doesn't highlight exactly there's an assumption people will kind of know along the way and yeah so i feel if that's the question

yes you can uh you know there's nothing wrong in the in meditating and doing things if it makes you a better person go for it you're doing it you're doing it cool let's i think uh because we've gone on quite a while with uh not with you but with the other person i was going to try and get in squeezing a few people whilst i can so cool muzammil it's been epic take care of yourself we'll speak all right so some questions there about um about meditative practices i think i'm not sure what they right we've got

here who have we got here we've got uh new intellectual people new intellectual here new intellectual new intellectuals [Laughter] i'm also from pakistan but living here in california please please visit california california sounds so awesome yeah i'll make biryani

[Laughter] i want to say i want to say if only islam was like like you the whole of islam was like your mentality it would be hard for me to leave it islam is like this is much better than my mentality but logo no no no no no no no your mentality is better than it uh i i love your mentality over over the actual doctrine

what is what is the uh the biggest problem the thing is okay the i the biggest problem is philosophy of uh the whole religion the whole philosophy of religion but uh what what i like about you is is that you are pro freedom you you do accept other people's uh you know uh opinions you're not as uh harsh as the other multis are that i have talked to and they have given me nothing but uh uh but said well

this is wrong this is wrong so you know they they've kicked me out and i have actually researched a lot and my research was actually from the quran itself not from not from uh hadiths or not from uh uh like other sources other secondary sources my my questions came directly from quran and they could not answer it so i i hope that multisab if you can uh give me some um if you can show inshallah i'll take you a question just you know just as a little uh footnote to what just before we just go into the question just so people

um you know hear this as well that look you know the this the message of the prophet sallal muhammad sallallahu alaihi has been so morphed by people to you know in their own image as well now we will find on so many occasions you will find these other narrations that people they've still trickled through but people will still try to push them out i mean whether it's things like uh i mean somebody had asked about prayer earlier on you know it's this thing where a person came to the prophet saying look i can't do this and the prophet said well what can you do he says well i can

okay do it you know it doesn't now people you'll have somebody saying look i don't i don't i don't wake up at that time he said to the prophet we don't wake up at that time i ain't going to pray so but uh we only wake up at this time the prophet said okay out of prayer you get these different but the point is that obviously people have tainted this is not yeah but this is not even the problem this is this is just the ritual praying is nothing i'm sure sure i understand i understand and also yeah so sure let's go to the questions

that might be yeah yeah the the question the thing is that even the terrorism you know the terrorism uh and uh the the the forcefulness of other muslims on other this is not even the problem for me even violence is not the problem for me you know what the problem is what is the problem the problem is the metaphysics the problem is the myth yes is the problem instantly is is myth myth miracles and magic i can't believe that i okay so first of all i mean the magic thing i don't think it's not really in the quran anyway it is

it is but okay um no and and uh every time every time sahara is mentioned allah mentions in the quranic perspective uh it shows that it was just an illusion because it mentions that they did on the eyes of people and in the other verse it mentions

that it was they imagined that this that the sticks were moving as snakes now this is why very early on people like imam abu hanifa and other people did clearly say there's no magic has no reality uh but yes people believed in medieval ages so they didn't they didn't say magic has not real reality they said that you should not believe in magic uh miracles miracles magic uh people like imam hanif and other people said

it is by the way i have a very detailed video on this to watch it as well but yep carry on yeah about yeah which which miracle miracle okay so when you said like about uh magic right uh okay okay you said that because i've mentioned that there's no a lot does the laws of nature are from god he does not go against his own laws of nature because they are set out by him so i don't know there's nothing in the quran that goes against the

state to go again yeah but like what it doesn't actually i've got like every single miracle you can imagine i've got a video clip on it probably explaining but which one comes to your mind uh okay a stick a non-living thing change becomes a living thing for example a stick becomes a snake by the will of god that is that is you know what doesn't it never does that peaceful no it never does now i've mentioned are you talking about the staff of moses yes yes yes yes so first of all the the sticks thrown by the other people the quran clearly mentions that it was not uh it was that it was just they imagined that it

was happening now when moses throws his stick there's two interpretations um that i feel uh fit here one is it mentions um the actual um that when he threw it that it consumed what they were fabricating now this particular verse there's so there's two ways to understand this one is some people felt oh it turned into this snake and it consumed it the other is that it consumed their fabrication

their life because when he threw it he exposed their magic so the two verses and i'll explain the other verse no and i'll tell you why this you know what move this i would love this interpretation over the magical interpretations that no it's not but the quran no but the quran you see so uh so for example in one of the verses there's three verses about the stars being thrown and the snake now in one it clearly mentions that there's as though it is a snake in one it's left ambiguous and in one it mentions it is a snake

it is a clear serpent so now they're all verses of the quran now you can't say well you know well well this because this one is saying it's not a snake it's as though and this one is saying it is now so one of these is definitely being metaphorical okay so whether you're gonna say so if it is a snake then in the verse where it says it's as though it's a snake that verse is very clearly saying no as though it was it's not saying it's a snake now so okay now the quran is not clearly saying that now i understand you

can understand you can take from it that the verse is saying oh that it turned into a snake the other interpretation by the way which i am more inclined to in recent times is that moses was akhenaten and this akhenaten he was the pharaoh akhenaten now this uh what he threw here was the royal scepter and it was because the royal scepter that they had had this snakehead to it and only the pharaohs had it because if you study the life of akhenaten when he goes off and he comes back how did they know you

see because one of the questions is this that moses goes away yeah okay and this is generally accepted whether people believe in moses or not but the story that they accept is moses goes away for many years does he not he goes away to midian and he marries and he does all these things and he comes back years later he comes back much later nobody uh whether they believe in moses or not they don't deny that story from moses's life so he stays there at least 10 years or whatever he's in midian he comes back much later how does he get straight how does he go straight up to the pharaoh how does he

get this um um the face time because he was raised in the pharaoh's house this is according to the islamic narrative no no even according to the biblical one he was raised in pharaoh's house uh nobody's denying that but you see how does he get up to that because he's coming back years later his age he's this old man and just because he says it they're gonna what the royal guards the palace before he even gets to the pharaoh how is he being let through the the fact is that um like he just said he just says by the way i'm i'm i'm this person they say oh

yeah come through yeah yeah because he was raised in pharaoh's house no but that's so first of all he nobody's saying he wasn't raised he was in he's from the palace over a decade over a decade ago and he was a christian so he was wanted he was he was wanted for the from the beginning because he killed no so he's coming back after all these years apparently he's his his face he's probably grown a beard now hasn't he because the pharaohs by the way didn't used to have beards you know the archaeologically the the the no i like how you say no i'm being very

clear this isn't you can just google this it's not like a so the the statues that the pharaohs had was a clip-on yeah yeah yeah yeah it wasn't and i don't know did you know that because i never used to know that before you did yeah i know okay okay that's that's very impressive because most people don't know that the pharaoh's beards were actually clip-ons that they used to use for ceremonies they were actually clean-shaven and they had this uh this strict thing about being clean-shaven so when he's gone away he's come back he's most like he's got this beard now he's he's aged um but this he so according to you and he's wanted but he's coming from a long way where

this must have been hundreds of guards along the way they're all giving him access to come right in up into the pharaoh just because he's a wanted conflict yeah that makes sense yeah i mean uh no i mean sure enough but to me it doesn't that's right that does not make sense to me the fact that the quran alludes to on several occasions this stuff of his this scepter like even in surat taha he is asked now meaning yeah what is that thing that you have in your right hand

yeah and he says oh uh it's my stuff now this yeah and he and he goes on to explain to justify why he's got it he says yeah uh here yeah uh i use it for uh sheep on it yeah i do others now this you know from a revelation point of view this is quite what's the purpose of this revelation here this like what is the point of this particular verses even if it is made up even if it's not from god but what is the you know there's some mystical purpose

here is uh basically to uh to challenge the authority the of the of pharaoh the child no no because no this this revelation is to do with god asking moses what is that in your right hand yeah yeah so what is the purpose of that because he's not at this time he's not in egypt he's he's not well he's not with he's not memphis or whatever he's not he's definitely nowhere near the pharaoh so he still has brought with him this stuff but move this up look at the big picture too this is now these stories are not coming from any any non-muslim sources these are coming from oh but but they are if you're looking at the story of akhenaten

i cannot now archaeology is one of the earliest monotheists that we have now you see in that version if that be correct moses still took with him the royal scepter because part of the uh the thing that the pharaohs had as their recognition was the royal scepter now when he takes that with him this was the thing that he is being reminded of in the quran as well this highlight that there's more you see why has he brought it with him now he's just saying oh using these excuses oh i've got this but because of the deep value that it has

when he goes back he when he throws that in front of the um no not the pharaoh uh in front of the magicians he doesn't throw in terms of pharaoh he only throws it in front of the magicians and they they submit to his authority because he was you see because the pharaohs if you look through history why did this why did they submit to his authority yeah because if you look through history right after akhenaten it's the it's the it's the the kind of military leaders that take over the pharaohs go through this whole fluctuation of turbulence they're not actually these great

even um well why they have to mention not magicians why they're mentioning magicians they're the best of the best thing they that come no no no no no the pharaohs no the magicians don't topple them why quran is basically saying that magicians were mystified so they it basically implies that there was miracles happening basically but they are like like if they are like the high priests that come you see pharaohs come from a royal lineage they are special people they're not like uh you see what what happens uh as you study history as it's been

documented after akhenaten there's a bit of a kind of like a throne grabbing that takes place and it fluctuates uh there's haram heb and all i think in the time if you go with akhenaten version when he comes back i think it's haramhem but these were all chiefs of military they were not from the pharaonic lineage now but akhenaten was now you see according to if he was that if that story be true and he threw that as a symbol of power to recognize who he truly was

uh to me that actually does carry a lot of sense obviously over the generations the story has been changed it's turned into obviously the israelites along the way changed it and the quran the quran kept it enigmatic but kept it still similar to the story of the israelites because it is a israelite sorry so basically it was it was a lie no basically who said it's a lie no i mean it's like it was miracles but because i never claimed it was a miracle where did the quran say it was a miracle as in it broke the laws of nature yes

uh why because a staff becoming a snake and eating i told you the verse i told first of all the quran quran never says he ate their snakes he says that is a verb it is not ya fikun anybody this is a plural verb what they were fabricating now it does not say that it swallowed their snakes show me one verse in the quran that says it swallow their snakes this is the only

verse you know what actually this is making me uh this is very pleasurable because you are bringing this naturalistic worldview yeah which is actually good i actually like this view i have detailed videos on all of these things on whatever you can possibly think of i've probably i mean if there's another big one coming to your mind i'll a lot yeah they're not gonna take up too much time but yeah oh yeah go for it oh yeah no uh there is one like for example ibrahim's birds

when he said that show me how there is there is going to be life after death god said to him yeah bring it get some birds cut it cut it in pieces put it on the mountain tops and uh ask them to uh to call them yeah and they they just they the birds came back to him and basic and this is actually one of the main reasons one of the main reasons like for example ibrahimovic you haven't you haven't watched my you haven't heard any of my replies of you and so obviously the problem is i could i won't be able to do justice here because obviously but i've i've replied to this very clearly once again just using the quran

i do not you know so the way when you said to me that oh the quran says it swallowed the snakes and i said that it doesn't actually say that the actual wording of the quran says it swallowed what they consumed sorry it consumed what they fabricated and it uses a verb it doesn't actually say that it did so now you can walk away saying oh i want to understand from that swallowed snakes take it that's your and the quran does that to allow people to take different meanings now but it doesn't categorically it could have easily just said it swallowed these things but it doesn't so here the quran as well he clearly

uses the word sorry for what i'm saying now what does this mean so the quran does not say anywhere clearly that he cut them up but it doesn't you know i've actually listened to your uh your video with veto vids and basically he he he makes a meme where he says you know this is the truth and you you're saying what is this truth and what is this yeah but look listen i understand because

no naughty naughty naughty naughty where he said that look what is reality and i said reality is not because he was talking about truth and i said well what is truth because truth is reality but the truth but this is not reality objective reality colors don't exist sound doesn't exist and he couldn't get past the colors do not exist don't exist in the real world this is a reflection of light isn't it being absorbed by the human eye it's not every it's not real so my point was that in objective reality there is no color

there is no smell there is no sound okay these these things in and he obviously he could understand the others but he couldn't understand sound and he was thinking sound has an objective reality you know and it was getting frustrating because i was trying to explain to him sound waves are just picked up by the aral faculties and interpreted they don't have an objective reality beyond being waves they don't have this sound that you're hearing right now this is only being heard by the human ear and it is being interpreted by the brain it doesn't sound exactly energy though no if there is sound waves there obviously the waves are vibrating

but the waves are not these words do you understand like this is an interpretation a reading of it by the human ear so do you do but anyway i mean you can you can you can check that with physics and just google it but the point is that obviously that he was understanding the rest of them but he just wouldn't understand sound and he got caught up assuming this objective sound and i was trying to explain to him because it was about music and i was explaining to him it doesn't actually exist but anyway that's not the point i love you i love you anyways now the point here is look i understand you you see what you don't want to do

you see i understand that you're saying that many muslims won't agree with my interpretation and that's a fair point but your other argument is an argument from ignorance and that's not a strong point to come from you see none of my arguments actually no it's from an because you're using a verse which i i'm explaining to you but this is the problem because it's like you if you're explaining hieroglyphics to me or chinese to me now if a person doesn't understand it they don't know whether what the other person is saying is true or not but it is like look take a look at that actual

verse take four birds now this verb sur is not what does this mean does not mean to cut it is not the verb used in arabic like it's not that verb the other problem with this verb is the challenge is why does god say okay let's say many of the mufasirin said this means to cut okay let's take it hypothetically if it meant that why does it say cut them away

towards you what what does that mean now like how does that make any sense even if it meant cut them why cut them towards you now it also says that basically make them make them uh make those birds you know uh uh make manus uh how do you say like um exactly that's exactly what it meant because it comes from the word this is when you you kind of like you do that whistling and you you're making a sound to bring them to you in common

yeah this is what the verse says now what you do is you bring them to you this sound this kind of sort of sort that a person makes with this sound bring them to you because then until you take care of them you kind of foster them in a way have this affinity how do you you can't just get i can't just get birds and they're going to have an affinity with me straight away yes that wouldn't happen i have to kind of take care of them

an affinity is taken you know it doesn't mention it doesn't go into the details but let's say you've had them for a certain amount of time they are now they have this affinity with you then then and now this is the problem people a now they said a juice means a portion so it does okay you could understand that but the the previous verb did not mean to cut you're forcing an interpretation what this verse meant was to have an affinity with them right and then place one of each four

on these mount hilltops okay then then call them hold them so where's the miraflores no you know listen no there was no look they we didn't see abraham look ibrahim in the verse said to god right allah says in the verse that look i am not uh like i it's not that i don't have faith but i want certainty how do you bring the life how do you bring the dead back to life yeah which is america god said that which would be a miracle but

by the laws of nature in this world faith must remain faith otherwise if it's empirical it's no longer faith then it's meaningless okay so if the reply is no so let me okay what happens here right what happens is he he fosters an uh an affinity he places one of the four birds on each of the hilltops he calls them and they fly to him

and allah shows him special about here the point is no no no so the the point is that what allah is showing him is by having this tiny affinity yeah these birds instead of flying away flew to you the soul has an infinitely much more greater affinity to god now that was the sign now you might say well no this doesn't make sense to me because i want to see as

a dead body coming back to life if that's the case okay let's say that's the case why does the verse say make them have an affinity they don't need an affinity to you you just catch them cut them put them yeah why did the verse actually says no the verse actually reads that you have to harbor them you have to kind of foster them for that's not the essential thing that's not true

you see you're the problem is you're you're misunderstanding revelation revelation was not this kind of textbook it was more like an art yeah you're reading it as though one reads a story book and you're thinking well you know like this is how i and that was never what revelation it was a quran you see it was not a in the sense it was not something that was just the the whole purpose of a quran was about its recitation its rhythm its art that it kind of the kind of reaction it evoked now i

understand it has stories and narratives in it but the point comes back to look these verses yes you can say to me mufti many people don't believe what you're saying i'm not i'm not debating that that's up to them but what you can't show me is what i've said is wrong by the actual arabic of the verses now and i in all these videos cite references i don't just make them up if you watch every single video i will cite scholars who have said this no more

yeah i totally like your interpretation i totally like that if if this was the dominant uh orthodox interpretation a dominating narrative you will only forever be misguided that is actually the verse of the quran is it not so now look i can ask look it's the same thing i said to vedavids it's the same thing i said to haris sultan same thing i said to abdullah guandal i said to these people it doesn't matter what you say

this world you cannot explain it you cannot explain consciousness you cannot explain that something greater exists now yeah i can if if we go by reason not okay i'll explain it uh consciousness is mind is your mind uh it's just another word what is mind what is the mind you have to focus it on yourself uh which is this mind of yours what is this mind what mind is your is your awareness is your uh basically the mind is not witness awareness is awareness

what is the mind what is consciousness what is what are these things consciousness you should okay you should you're you're looking it from a religious mystical perspective no i'm not no i'm not i'm asking you you said to me i'll explain it through reason explain it through reason okay mind is your uh your volition you know your your awareness yes you you have yourself okay so free will will to do something yeah yes is the mind it is it is consciousness it will take mind takes free will yeah and free evil and mine are interesting you said to me i will i can explain it through reason

explain it yeah yeah so mind is your you can actually focus in yourself and you can introspect that's not a definition well no that that uh i'm since i'm not a i'm not a uh psychologist but i can be a psychologist but i can give i can i can give you you said a moment ago yeah basically in basic layman terms that mind is your is your uh consciousness is your mind basically which is dependent on your brain

and your mind is dead as well no because you did yeah and your mind is connected to your your body so and it's integrating i i don't have it yeah i don't have a mind body problem with all the philosophers beginning no so uh no so tell me what about the the the brain being a receiving device of consciousness that's proposing as highlighted by hopefully as i like about these evidences yeah you can't receive it you can't if you're receiving it so it's not in the brain then if you're receiving it no brain is the is the organ that uses it for example for example i'll give you i'll give you another scraping device let me simplify

for you for the receiving device consciousness is non-local that means it does not live in the brain it's only it's like a telephone picking up the signal it is not like the signal doesn't look like a material thing don't treat it like a brain is material yeah brain is material but consciousness is consciousness immaterial it's yeah it's immaterial it is a process so if it's non-local if it's non-local it is not a process then it is a thing so you have to make up your mind which is it like a soft opposite it's a it's a software you you're holding a phone in your hand it's a

software it is in the brain it is so software is in the computer so so it is in so basically consciousness what you're saying but all this study is that have shown non-local consciousness so i i gave the example of all the case studies of the people for example when um the book i've got here by the award-winning cardiologist who showed over decades of research that when people went into cardiac arrest even after brain death right when there was no brain activity being picked up yet people were having when they had visions

so it's not it's not that the whole brain was uh was the whole brain that are used like the frontal cortex and these things that have visions that will the creative elements that will show things these were not flagging up at all activity was dead on them so uh he his whole book is based on in fact with hari sultan when i showed it to him in our debate this was one of you obviously there is no response to these things can i give you an analogy to make you understand this brain and brain and mind thing for example yes

yes for example vision you know vision vision does not just vision does not just exist with uh without uh any anybody any any hardware vision is is like your software it it depends on your hardware which is your eyes so if you terminate your eyes if you gorge your eyes out vision dies your vision dies you can't see a little okay this is exactly how it is okay so no no first of all okay it's the visual cortex in the brain that interprets vision the signals okay the retina is not the processing thing uh so it's actually the brain so that

that analogy actually doesn't fit that analogy actually supports what i'm saying in the sense that the brain the visual cortex right it is picking up the signals from the retina of the outside world though now it's interpreting it through yes the electrochemical signals that are then being interpreted by the visual cortex and being projected back to to you to understand what is going on and what you're seeing but the things outside do actually exist outside so me seeing this microphone yeah although i'm seeing it inside my head it actually has an existence outside exactly it does it so consciousness even

if it is being processed by the brain as in it's being picked up by the brain does not negate that consciousness does not have an existence it doesn't have anything yeah it does have an existence but it is you're saying that consciousness no it's connected to the body sorry yeah it it is connected with the brain it is connected once but there's no evidence to show that once brain is it's it's dead and it's rotted in the grave there is that doesn't make any sense that's like saying look the visual cortex is what interprets vision yeah going back to your but if i was to somebody was to gorge your eyes out now you no longer can see because

they've destroyed the eyes but the eyes were not what were producing vision for you it was actually the visual cortex but they are the receptors now if you damage the receptor obviously it doesn't work like it's similarly your brain if i damage this phone it's not going to work it doesn't mean the signal it doesn't exist anymore but still exists similarly if i so if somebody was to shoot me in the brain or they would shoot me and i died now obviously i now i don't exist so i can't be picking up the signal that's not an argument against non-local consciousness that's just to say well if the transmitter doesn't exist

obviously how can it be picking up the signal yeah how how can how can you be picking up the signal you want you won't be functioning and that's called yeah but yeah but that doesn't mean this doesn't show the signal doesn't exist yeah signal exists because it's what i mean sorry let me simplify it for you this phone it picks up a signal it does not generate the signal but if i smash this phone it doesn't pick up the signal but it doesn't mean the signal was being made by this phone just because i smashed it the signal was still out there it was being picked up by the phone and your consciousness is not out there both this up it's connected it is healthy

no but how do you can your consciousness can your consciousness go and control other consciousnesses like mine right okay okay now you can only do that no no no no you can only do that through language and by convincing there have been okay tell me something there's been several studies on people can tell that they're being stared at yeah i don't know are you aware of these studies are stared up like uh stay stayed to stay to look at if somebody's staring at someone um studies have demonstrated

beyond probability human beings can tell when somebody's staring at them well are you familiar with that yes that means so you know working there not what sense okay what sense is picking for example if if someone stares staring at you you you probably can notice for example the sense of sight the sense of sight you're not looking at them staring at you when people are being stared at like so i'm walking somebody's staring at me from there most people when being stared at can

detect somehow that somebody is staring at me and they look now there's been actual studies on this several studies in psychology you can actually just google the results they are above probability so for them to be random they are they're way above probability for that now they can't explain how human beings can tell but they can tell more often than not than somebody staring at them they're ex there is very sensitive senses they're very sensitive which sense you for example the sense of sight the sense of smell the sense in which sense no so somebody is looking at me yeah right so somebody's in that building they're looking at

i'm walking in the road i can't i get this feeling somebody's staring at me i'm not making these studies up by the way you could just google them right so what sense is my sense of smell telling me somebody is staring at me from this is exactly the you know this is exactly like the bollywood movies when you know the shahrukh khan meets heretic russian and the ma basically kind of oh i know okay there's another

no no depends what you mean by this this is why i didn't use the word telepathy because depends what you mean by it like if you mean by it like somebody i'm talking here and you're completely understanding my thing i'm not i don't i'm not meaning that by i mean low-level connections like so for example there have been studies that many people many people in their life you've probably experienced this many people have sometimes picked up a phone without looking who's calling and known who is calling now sometimes it could just make sense because i'm expecting a call but so but on many occasions people have just out of the blue they've not like you if you've thought

about somebody today who you've not thought about for four or five years and today he phones you yeah dogs like for example dogs are a very good example of study this once again you can check the research dogs know when the owners are coming home from work like at a particular time even though they're not close and they are still quite far not to be able to be picked up the dog is inside the building and the dogs get restless very sensitive sense of smell they can sense no no no in the house and the other person because no because you the other person's in a car yeah he's not outside the house he is reasonably still far it cannot be picked

up by the olfactory senses and the dogs i challenge this i challenge you to to close your eyes and drive with the with yourself without you not you i'm not talking about you i'm talking look just because you're not familiar with this research does not mean that like you see you're arguing from a point of ignorance like that's the difference you said a moment ago i don't know about psychology now i'm telling you all these studies exist now you what about the study of uh where you've got um uh brain correlation uh so where they had people in one room with a loved one in the other room where they showed them

certain lights and it triggered certain brain activity neural activity which would correlate brain correlation distant brain correlation studies where it would correlate that the the loved one would demonstrate similar neural activity without seeing the lights these studies exist but just because you're not familiar with them you know they're also from a point of ignorance there's also studies done for example and these are basically sensationalizations uh there are also studies done of like for example reincarnations like people were born and their conscious consciousness is

connected with this consciousness and this is nonsense but you can you can see that there are there are let's just people know look let me ask you something look with this i'm not saying look people pseudoscience theories no no wait there this what i've said to you has actually yeah i'm quoting to you psychologists and scientists i'm not quite i'm not quoting to you some guru these studies of distant brain correlation this distance of a psychokinetic uh or sorry uh this kind of psy phenomena where you have low level you see when you said telepathy i i didn't use that word on purpose because i didn't like the the term because obviously people understand why

no because people because of what urban myths have polluted it so urban myths have you know you have technical words and you have other common usage so people would say oh this is telepathy i'm talking right now i'm telling you about a storybook and you're picking it up but it's not like that but it is true what you said a mother and a child a mother and a child is above probability when the child has been in danger the mother has sensed anxiety these levels these things exist and beyond levels of probability these are not random like if you took it at random it would not appear like that from a scientific perspective i was

something like better sense like that spider sense yeah but do you see just because you don't know about these studies you you you see that is an argument from ignorance argument from evidence i prefer my five senses and my five senses are are connected with reality are connected with my brain not okay okay let me ask you then let me ask you right prove me something from these five senses okay sure sure sure how do you know this is not a dream how do i know yeah how do you know that this isn't just a dream because i can observe i can observe what

makes you think you can't observe in a dream yeah because you know dream world is totally different you know i think if this is a dream then this is that i've been i've been i've been practicing uh what's it called tell you let's say you are just a brain in a jar somewhere right that's kind of that's all you are you're not and this is really just a dream that you're having yeah yeah this this is de cartien way of thinking i'm not asking about cartesian stuff i'm asking you asked me to ask you something that and you will be able to prove it with your senses prove it to me that this is not a dream because i can observe this is like

platonic no but what makes you think in your dreams you can't observe i can but in my dreams my dreams are not wishy-washy they're woozy wishy-washy uh is this this this is not dream this is this is this reality how do you know this isn't a dream because this is this reality has this reality has identity something called law of attention or do you do you do do you from us prove to me like how the fact that this universe has an identity why can't it have an identity in a dream because dreams are wishy-washy you can

basically you can where'd you get that from your interest is that what is that when you sleep tonight no i never asked you that i asked you when you sleep tonight when you sleep tonight i'm not talking about my dreams i'm asking you you're saying dreams must be wishy-washy where do you get this law from introspect if your introspection is based on a dream then it's going to be in accordance with that dream isn't it reality is reality this is not a dream this is why i'm far ahead because i know this is reality how do you know how how explain to you

because of the law of identity i can observe for example i had but that look look what this is answer the question if you can answer it or just be honest look i've asked you can i'm honestly you're not being honest no either either you're oblivious or you're not being honest because i can't tell you that the greatest minds in this world have all acknowledged it is impossible i don't care about this no

look then either you're arguing from stupidity or you're arguing so what what argument do you have that this is not a dream can you observe one you can observe right yeah you you have the sense of observation right you can observe that you the things you hold in your hand for example that cell phone that you hold it has an identity right it cannot become yeah this this cell phone cannot become a cat despite the fact that you have certain traditions where it says that a staff can become a snake but we can freaking we can put that aside so this thing in dreams

and dreams and can happen in dreams no one told me i observed it i have confidence in my observation can you have can you have a dream within a dream you you can't have that but okay so in this dream you've had dreams where things move but in your outer dream they don't uh-huh yeah so but i can observe it because the things that uh that uh in my dreams uh for example the things but those are you but those are the dreams you're having but those are the dreams you're having within this dream

but how do you not the outer dream how tall that behaves because of the law of identity you only know that by the dream you're having within this dream though you see you can have a dream within a dream can't you so right now this wakeful state i'm telling you is just a dream and i'm telling you to prove it to me it's not and you're saying i can tell you it's not because the dreams i have within this state they said law of identity i said law of identity but they only occur to you in this state i'm telling you this whole state there is no law enforcement identity in in dream world

there isn't any law of identity you know at this stage we're just wasting time because you you're just arguing out of arrogance and stubbornness like i don't tell you in all honesty no if it's confidence then it's confidence in stupidity because it's confidence in reality i i believe in reality you believe in magic you i mean you believe in illusions first of all and first of all i i don't believe in illusions secondly i look i i i know this is not even in reality look i've given you plenty of time you're making me a skeptic look you're making yourself i'm asking you to one simple thing i ask you and this is going to be a problem that you will

struggle with throughout your life right i'm asking you on honesty and transparency and i can tell wallahi i can tell i know it's not sacred to you but it's to me i can tell in this conversation you're not prepared to be transparent and i can tell that by just the argument that you were just doing a moment ago now if that's fine look it's your life it's your views but if that's your outlook on life then you will never attain a truer sense of understanding because look you're just being stubborn like i told you a moment ago that look i can tell you that this argument this is it this what i'm telling you

is the but you you wouldn't accept like your point is no i don't care what i'm telling you that this is a fact of this world that you cannot prove this world to not be a dream that that is a fact as far as think nobody can prove this world is not a dream and you can i mean you can just google if you trust google more now you saying any answer you say is either then based on stupidity or it's suspicious law of identity but you know if i cannot can be from within the dream no it cannot did you observe your dreams the law of identity does not exist in your brain look see now the fact that you can't

either understand it or stubborn to do something does it just i have entertained some of your questions and maybe for viewers as well you can watch my videos i would seriously tell you my serious advice is you need to humble yourself from this stubbornness okay because in all honesty in all honesty it's either because i i refuse to i don't want to choose the latter that is just because you're stupid that's i i wouldn't want to i would not

want that to be the reality right because the reality in this discussion i can clearly see you're not moving beyond certain points which are very factual they don't really they don't go you know it's either this like that and the point is anyway speak to speak to your gurus and ask them i have no gurus i i have my my my observations i don't have any gurus you see this journey is it's a long journey here okay this whole journey of life of faith of understandings i see the fact that institutionalized religion

is tainted uh it definitely is but one you know there's a very interesting verse of the quran that do not let people when they have been unjust to you or they have been tyrannical or they have been oppressive or wrongdoers do not let that action of theirs eventually render you into someone who moves away from justice or the truth like because you will see that look religion a lot of people in religion are toxic a lot of people in religion are poisoned they're hateful

they you know they're very oppressive but don't let that make you become just the same thing like just because you hate on them no i don't care about them it doesn't matter what we say they're they're not they're not the problem the problem is people who actually believe in who don't believe in uh in reality they are the skeptics skeptics of reality they're not look it's not that it's it's not sometimes knowing it's the things we're unaware of the biases inshallah leave you with that you have a good evening yeah you you too youtube right so people we gotta wrap this up

it's gone on you know what let's i'll take one two quick um [Music] all right so i've already had some of you guys on some mil i've had you on already um caesar salad oh right there's no camera for him let me add you quickly to it assalamu alaikum how are you doing how are you doing were you joining us from uh i'm in canterbury oh rather

the accent oh well rather from canterbury shukran for joining us at this ungodly hour uh what are you any comment thoughts um we are keeping it a bit brief because i've been going on way too long man so i just wanted to talk about the soul a bit because you said it's consciousness right say that again oh yeah yeah yeah according to me yeah yeah yeah i agree with that as well so i just wanted to know if you think animals have a soul as well i feel that animals

are not conscious the way we are they don't have our level of kind of consciousness this consciousness that we have is human that i'm speaking of is the human specific one okay it doesn't mean they don't have life and conscious see consciousness is used in many ways somebody say he's unconscious he's conscious um it's a term that has many different meanings to different people what i mean by is the we have that greater reflexive um ability

to conceptualize things that to me is the rule that is enabling triggering that so animals don't have that they don't have that level of ability they have some you know if you want to use the word consciousness they have a lower level of consciousness but it's not nothing compared to what we have yeah so um with animals like go to heaven and hell after after they die [Laughter]

it's not the the after world the the world of the afterlife is not something we can comprehend really um will there be other creatures in this are in this world in the after world there will be i i feel that they will but must they be the creatures that continued from here i don't think so no um i think more like the main thing is in my understanding is the human species we are in in many ways we're kind of like a simulation in this world

yeah it's like that yeah so um it's us that counts in that it doesn't mean we we should be we should still watch out for the environment and be watch over and watch over animals and all of that but they are not the the main characters of that simulation so to understand yeah do you think we have um an obligation to like minimize animal suffering and stuff like that

um right now yes we it's right okay so we we can in we are where we are afflicting it um then of course or where the environment around us because of us is afflicting it then yes um otherwise no we don't have an obligation to just intervene in nature so do we have an obligation to prevent the line from hunting

no we don't yeah do we do we have an obligation to like not hunt as well because so what's your what's your what's your response usually to like um veganism and vegetarianism and stuff like that you see i'm not a vegetarian yeah i respect i respect people who are uh but i'm not to me i feel that i am against cruelty of this kind of uh factory the way you know the conditions in which animals are being kept i'm against that kind of stuff and that's cruel but i'm not against hunting per se

like i would feel that it is just another part of nature we are ultimately part of nature hun animals hunt each other and humans are also animals within that chain who will hunt other animals um i just feel that's the laws of nature i i guess i do guess sorry i do accept that it is cruel um sorry not cruel it is brutal um it has a brutal perspective to it uh but such is nature i feel it is nature is brutal but that brutality is an intrinsic and

inherent part for the dynamism of life and for evolution to have flourished it was a necessary component you see you see where certain sometimes in certain places where certain elements are removed the ecological outcome is not actually favorable it becomes massively problematic you know when certain predators are removed you think oh that's a kind thing but it actually if you if you look at some of the ecological studies where um certain you know complete landscapes have been

devastated because certain predatorial elements were removed who no longer could hunt something which then in turn would not hunt this which then in turn led to and and it leads to a it upsets the the kind of balance um i'm not saying i get the fact that it is greedy that we um you know we eat animals and it's not pretty and it's uh visually disturbing unconscious on our conscience i think it's disturbing as well

but it is nature it is the world because i think like the difference between us and most predators is that they're carnivores so they have to live on meat whereas i think humans they don't necessarily need to have meat it is just like greediness and just wanting it basically because i believe at some point in our evolutionary history um we would have to have meat at some point which is why we evolved to eat it that would have been a point where there was nothing else left but i think now like there's a lot of alternatives that we have that true

that's cool you see i i agree that um i mean we are omnivores and you're right we can uh survive on a vegan diet or a vegetarian diet we can survive but yeah then what's the point of such survival [Laughter] i'm joking if you're going to live a totally vegan gluten-free life then you might as well just put yourself out of the misery now and no i'm joking now the the i do agree we can survive we can do it

um i don't know about the fact that we i don't agree that we are herbivores by default we're not uh but i but we can survive on a vegetarian so the fact that we are designed in certain ways with certain teeth and certain things that we we are definitely designed and have evolved with a meat eating lifestyle but the difference is can we survive without eating meat we can but i don't think so i don't agree that we're not herbivores who have become uh who have adapted to a

meat-eating lifestyle i feel we are carnivores by default um but we can survive without it so i mean i don't know we might i don't know whether people might disagree with me on that but i'm just saying the way i see by default we're not vegetarians i don't know if you agree with that um but i that's how i see by default we're not but we can live like that if we had to so the question is why don't we live like that yeah i would say well part of it is because by default we were carnivores

so we will forever uh kind of we will have that kind of yearning for meat i feel but what we can do is we can substitute it with artificial needs yeah as as technology improves so if we had like let's say we had chicken that was chicken same protein without it being from a chicken it was made in the lab

in that case would i encourage us eating that chicken as opposed to the actual chicken so if we've got artificial chicken and it's had the same amount of protein same amount of amino acid same amount of you know i could do all of that then yeah sure of course i would say because the body would wouldn't be able to tell the difference so the body would just want meat and that would be meat even though it's fake meat but it would still for the body would quench it what it wants so yeah definitely if we had that widespread like you could go get a burger you could eat a steak

but it's not it's fake meat but it still gives you all the things that the steak would have i would definitely support it and i would definitely become that version of a of a vegan but uh i think up until then um yeah but i do agree with the cruelty in which animals are being kept is is wrong 100 agree with that yeah so do you not think that by like paying the meat industry in the dairy industry that you're supporting their cruelty uh say that again oh am i yeah because because i'm going to buy that book

yeah somebody has to factory yeah but you see that that world that market is way too huge for one individual or two or a hundred or a thousand you see as long as there are human beings there will be that market so the only way it will cease to exist is if we had an equally powerful market that was uh that could provide substitute meat which i know scientists are on the verge of like they have made it but they haven't mass

produced it um otherwise the market wouldn't kind of dwindle away with just one or two people stop not eating isn't isn't that kind of like saying that there's no point of me giving like one pound or ten pounds to charity because that's not gonna like solve everything like the amount of giving is not really adding to the total isn't that kind of the same kind of logic you see the question would come okay let me flip this back then it's like i ask many people who are vegan or vegetarian that in that case

why should we not prevent the lion from hunting because the lion the lion needs to hunt to fulfill itself so but we can physically intervene though but how do we how do we like make sure the lion survives no so the point is no that's not our job we're just going to prevent the murder of the gazelle so is it okay under our watch to allow this gazelle to get eaten if if it means let's say we've got a let's say we've got a huge national park that's got some wildlife in it and this is under

our like we can actually do something about this massive piece of land that we've got and in it are lions let's see and you've got gazelles or dears now we can physically prevent these from getting murdered we can we can do it yeah or we can just turn a blind eye and let them get butchered just because the lions need to eat them yeah yeah so so if the lions don't eat them then the lions will die right but that's no but that's not our responsibility we're not killing them no

we we are saving bloodshed yeah but we it's like um we're basically like killing them by a mission almost no so it's like so you agree so so you're saying let them as an active choice let them kill the deers or let the lions die right no but no if something dies when it dies that's you know we hasn't died yet as it hasn't died because of us it's just dying that that lion could just fall ill with cancer and it could just drop dead it could just die but here these things we

are making an active choice to allow this look here's this line coming running yeah i can close the door and save this dear yeah i just have to get the gate but i am actively saying you know what now consciously so it's a conscientious decision let this dear get killed you you agree i should let it get killed i should i should so i'm acting i'm participating in the murder of this deer i personally wouldn't

so you would prevent it from getting killed yeah so you feel is it humanity should do that as a collective to some degree but you feel we should yeah no i think i think if we'd need rather rather cruel yeah it is but i think if it's between the death of the lion and the death of the deer the deer is going to suffer more than the lion is i would think right so it's about suffering yeah i think it's about suffering i think so okay so in that case why didn't you just

why don't you just shoot the deer yeah instant death yeah and just give it yeah your line i think that's what that would be so you would agree on instantly massacring massacring beers to make the lion happy but as long as it's instant massacre yeah then it would minimize the pain so in a way to insta to minimize the pain what if we to make it easy rounding all the deals up together in one massive place um within with one switch of a button they just instantly died yeah and that thought my friend is just a step away from the battery farms where they've got all these cows

in one place it's not that they don't instantly die they'll have to i think with no i said it's a step away so is it the so is it the concept of killing them or is the concept of just how they die it's the concept of suffering because they're sentient creatures like us and they experience they're always gonna suffer if you kill them well then i think in our case we don't have to kill them because we don't have to eat them yeah but they but what about where we can intervene and stop them from being killed and suffering yeah then we just go with the then we just go with the the option of killing them with the least possible

pain right so so so we should run around hunt them proactively and feed them to the other carnivores like yeah if it's practical yeah you've got to be the most radical vegetarian or vegan i've ever i'm not proactively i'm i i eat meat we should proactively hunt all these damn things i think everything is freezing it's just like a like a thought basically you know what it is uh i um

i look i agree that it's this is actually one of those kind of catch-22s that i don't think people can get out of um it is just the world that we live in it's a doggy dog world and it's a very brutal world um and we are a part of it and we are trying to apply a certain amount of structure and civility to it um but we won't be able to change nature we just won't be able to our nature is by its definition brutal isn't isn't that the is all fallacy that since it is like that

it ought to be like that and we shouldn't do anything to change it i mean in this particular case you agreed that look when it was about should we actively save these animals um you know and you said well okay in your case you said we should proactively go around killing them off and just to feed them i mean that's a in many ways much more brutal because you know you're proactively killing you're not even letting the other things kill you but you're killing them it's less suffering that way that's like the fanatic who says look

don't worry you know i'm killing you it's all for the sake of god don't worry you know um you'll be you'll be pleased to know i'm doing this upon wudu i think another thing is with the milk industry um milk yeah with dairy dairy um yeah yeah the the cows sorry the cows have to be um they have to be raped essentially cows have to be raped yeah

[Laughter] what kind of things have you been watching not this it's just what happens in the in the dairy farms because they they have to rape cows they have to they have to artificially inseminate them oh that's raping artificially yeah that's what is what's the alternative consent uh i mean i guess i don't think nature works quite that way i don't think uh animals go around consenting in that way that human beings but don't like do you think it's not possible for an animal to be

raped no it is but i think that's pretty much a huge part of nature is just that of animals being raped i mean i don't think you'd use the word rape i think people may use it but i wouldn't use it in nature that's like saying you don't use the word murder in nature do you not say this lion murdered the because there's there's a sense of uh kind of responsibility that you're you're kind of attributing to the culprit so when you say rape you're attributing this element of the ought to be consent and

this kind of and obviously nature doesn't work quite that way that you know it doesn't work with human reasoning it just has instincts and it just acts on instinct so i i wouldn't i mean maybe people i have read the term things like duck rape and where there's a kind of gang rape of a duck but i i wouldn't personally use these terms with nature because i think that's like using the word murder with nature it doesn't really or fraud with nature you know like this monkey he defrauded the other monk you know i wouldn't use it quite like that yeah so but these are problems that won't go away

i guess in this case it's the human doing it though to the cow oh right yeah yeah and the you're talking about the inseminating yeah yeah artificially inseminating the cow and once they give birth to the to the um the baby cow they take they take them away no i i i agree with you that i do agree that the conditions in which things are being kept and are wrong and very um you know they're very i don't know about brutal but they're very kind of i mean they are brutal but i'm thinking of a better word to describe it but it's

very um they are utterly unacceptable they are treacherous conditions under which they've got you know these battery farms and chickens and the way they grow them and the way they and with cows as well and stuff and i agree all of that argument i i believe can be improved and hopefully will be improved with with pressure from um from from groups and organizations but as to uh abolishing the the kind of meat market i just don't believe that would ever happen because i feel that there's a deep-seated human um kind of urge

even if we don't recognize it i think there is there at a subconscious level do you think like even if we did develop artificial meat there would still be some people that would want to have the natural then then i think what would happen is the body the urges can't tell the difference so they would be met so it's like yeah like like we haven't like we develop a thirst and we need water now if you obviously there's natural water but if you created water artificially the body wouldn't be able to tell the difference it would just be met with its its urge being fulfilled yeah yeah so it would like it'd be like the

the brain and that thing i suppose but i think that would um i mean the body is obviously mechanical and it runs it has these impulses and if they're being met they're being met i guess and it wouldn't really um it wouldn't really tell and in fact i'm sure many people would be happy with that i i would be very happy to you know switch immediately to artificial meat uh provided it it kind of provided the same thing yeah for him i have to say i'm very impressed and and i do like your concern and i think

that's um what do you do by the way student or yeah i'm a student i'm doing um i'm doing a masters in astronomy space science and astrophysics bloody yeah look at that brother that's really good man i'm i have to say wow you're doing it man yeah i send you a lot of memes on instagram i think you see okay what what's your page there uh it's just uh oh i'll tell you what oh my god after this and i'll look out for it because i get a lot of what is it message but sometimes i'm not sure who

they um you know who they matching the faces to the profiles but i'll look out for it now for him it's been epic man shook him for sharing that thought experiment right you're doing it you're doing it for a moment you almost had me i'm joking now i i'm you've converted me if you can provide me the alternative i'll take it take care man much love islam guys it's been going on way too long man you know what i need to that reminds me i need to go eat some food honestly you know what uh quick ather khan assalamu alaikum we've got to keep it

brief but where are you joining us from sure uh i'm i live in new jersey you're doing it you're doing it so uh it's a pleasure to talk to you or i don't know the decrement uh you understand okay okay so uh uh i have a few questions

yeah i mean i for the viewers that the question is that is the deen complete within the quran or is there more to the deen outside of the quran you see to me the way i see it is the quran you see this this answer can be or this question can sometimes be mis not purposely but it can be misleading as in it can lead people to i'm not i'm not saying you're asking in a misleading way you're not but it can people expect a very binary response they expect that there's an assumption

like when i ask a question there's an assumption that there's an answer that matches that question but the answer doesn't have to be that way it's like if just if i asked you know what is heavier red or blue just because i asked the question doesn't mean the answer would if there is an answer would be like that so in this case obviously there is an answer the quran is set out in such a way that it tells you that look this is the backbone to this theme this is the scripture around which the deen

will revolve it's like the kind of sun in the solar system but it teaches you that look there will be and if the quran is giving this to you that they will be rasool that they will be things will also come from the rasool wa and things will come from other people as well the quran is telling you that take these things but you may disagree at times amongst yourselves so i feel that our greater understanding of islam is it's kind of

rooted in the quran but yes the quran is not going to go into finite detail about everything the quran really is going to tell you the important key messages but it's going to plant certain seeds in explaining that look there will be something you know there is a exemplary example for you in the messenger of allah um why don't you take what the messenger also expands on the the quran will say it there will be other people it will mention

there will be you know there will be an ibrah in this for who maybe everybody won't get it but the so the answer is that the quran will serve that central position but the living tradition will revolve around it always and that will at that will reflect the day and age that it's in if that makes much sense

but then there raises more it is fully detailed when quran says is this not sufficient for you this book then are we not taking the word of allah too lightly

to go over and above or beyond quran and look for very good forces does it not make our deen more complicated when quran says it's very simple sure now very good question uh what i would say is that you see when it is true the quran is sufficient but it's you see any any any statement is within it's not in a vacuum it's within a context so when the quran is saying that is this revelation not sufficient for you it's saying this to people who were from a different revolut from a different tradition it was saying

it to people who were saying uh that it's not talking about oh when i say perform the hajj will hajj have detail to it that's not what it's talking about it's not trying to say oh are you allowed to have uh road traffic laws it's not talking about that it's talking about people saying that look no we're not going to accept you know we've got this particular scripture when the prophet was amongst them he was telling them about islam they weren't interested or they were interested a bit and they were interested in and it's addressing them that's the context to it

so yeah i mean otherwise the question is good but that's what it means it's within a context it has to be contextualized oh sorry no i was gonna say it's really late today i'm surprised i was actually thinking i'll just do two hours today

people it's been ever so awesome you guys need to go get yourself some sleep get yourself some rest i need to go eat some food have an awesome day wherever you are much love people do we have hit 20k subs on the youtube you're doing it you're doing it people you're doing it do you spread the love spread the fitness as i say the instagram if you want to message me i will look out for your messages must eat some good meat i will try

right much love salam allahi alaikum over and out folks over and out