Faith & Psychedelics| Meetup with Al Murabituun | Mufti Abu Layth

what's going on yes where are you joining us from first and foremost joining you from uh Copenhagen Denmark Allah yeah the land of the one of the first hypotheses given to quantum physics the Copenhagen hypothesis the Copenhagen you know they have a it's called The Copenhagen uh explanation which is that

um when you observe the quantum realm it it collapses I think they name it the Copenhagen because when they were arriving at the experiment and the results it was done from Copenhagen that's why they just call it the Copenhagen kind of uh hypothesis but yes talk to us I can see you're fresh right in the jungle no I was I was asking questions earlier on this okay about Ayahuasca so I thought it was it could be funny behind me yeah talk to us fresh from the Fresh from

Mother Nature huh yeah yeah yeah no I wasn't in the jungle I was just here in Denmark but um no yeah I just no I came I came home from a retreat for three days on an island three days wow yeah and I and I did the two uh Ayahuasca ceremonies wow actually what sorry what's your what's your do you mind your name or my name is Eunice Eunice Eunice I just yeah right so Eunice do you mind me asking had you prior to I want to just come to this thing but prior to the Ayahuasca had you

uh embarked on anything any mushrooms anything else or was it just pure the Deep dive yeah um I I had I haven't I've never tried anything at all I haven't even tried to smoke so uh the reason for my interest inside was because I had some stress related symptoms I guess in my body okay and um so I contacted somebody and I got and I got some uh some psilocybin in in capsules like in pills

in the active ingredient from mushrooms for people yeah yeah so it's pretty good for it's supposed to be good for anxiety etc etc so I was thinking about micro dosing just to try it out okay wow just one pill Monday Thursday so but I didn't what days are Monday yeah so I but anyways I uh I didn't start with it because uh then I stumbled across Ayahuasca and I remember you you spoke about psychedelics and Ayahuasca and was like okay so is that Haram maybe there's something to it that it could actually be beneficial and uh so I was

just started to research and there was some some Danish scientists are starting to research it the psilocybin Etc see and I just want to just say here you see the key operative word here people you see following on from what you just said that look you don't believe it's it's Haram because I don't believe it's Haram and I've got a video but the key word you said there is I've researched it you see once I had interest I started to research it and you started to explore it yourself like as in learn about it but sorry carry on yeah uh and obviously you know way back I I

listened to Mike Tyson talk about DMT and etc etc and uh so I just uh I stumbled across a website where they offer those Retreats here in Denmark so I was like okay I don't need to go to the Jungle so I just in two weeks I just uh I did the diet okay because two weeks prior to the ceremony you have to do a diet they want you to do a certain diet a certain diet yeah yeah so yeah and I went there it was I was so nervous because you don't know anybody you know the people it takes so much to trust it is one because I mean that is that is something and so because you've got

because that that is an advanced level you know you've gone straight into this you've not joined he didn't even waste time with an intermediate you said I was straight into Advance which is DMT so okay so you turn now yeah you think yeah man it was I mean I turned up and it was a nice place people were hugging so nice etc etc like okay I had my own room but I was just I was so nervous because uh so I just kept walking for hours oh my God it was freaking sometimes you just don't want to think about it because I didn't want to think about it I'm just going to

keep walking moving and just doing other stuff that I was just praying so much like please don't let me die I was I prayed to God it's so intense it's like oh my God I'm gonna die you know and I'm on a Lyle Island and I didn't really tell anybody you know because the sigma said I'm not going to tell my parents so I'm gonna go on an island drink so I just said okay I'm gonna go meet God and uh yeah maybe die a couple of times and come back but no yeah so um yeah so uh there were two ceremonies and uh I drank the cup and he he called

it means like there are mattresses in a room and it's yeah it's a little bit weird it's like they blow smoke out and they sing songs Etc and it's like anyway that's the kind of yeah that's the kind of yeah yeah ceremony thing but yeah okay yeah anyways I drank the cup and I was just like laying there and then waiting for something to happen I was like oh my God I'm just and then it was just like a very uh I was I just had a fever like a kind of feverish warmth and extreme nausea so I was like I called and was like oh get this out of me I wanted to stop because it was so worse Ayahuasca does that doesn't it

because it gives the whole sickening kind of feeling it's a very yeah yeah you often throw up you you throw up they call it the purge because you used to throw up yeah yeah so yeah yeah so uh it was just a lot of nausea and then in the end of a ceremony I was just like you know saying sorry to God please you know I'm gonna I'm gonna you know just like an intense uh kind of the two hours like yeah just crying Etc um so yeah um that was the first ceremony okay and the second ceremony was crazy

because it was in the tenth and there was a big fire in the middle of the of the tent so the the atmosphere was just much more intense but the second time was just I had they gave me an advice they said don't fight it the next time just just relax and just accept it the more the medicine is going to tear you apart because your ego doesn't want to to let go yeah you know it's amazing because at its core the message is to a slim to surrender yeah you know that submit yeah it's amazing because

that is crazy it reflects you know Intimates these messages of faith that like you just surrender yeah submit yeah Allah and I tried it so I just laid there and I was like just relax relax and uh I didn't get any nausea but then I just felt it like boom it was just it's like it was like a hug and I could just see like uh like something from nature just uh trying to Encompass you trying to to to you know to just overwhelm you and then it's like please don't hurt me instead of what don't don't if you're if

you know just be gentle don't kill me don't kill me and then um it just became so overwhelming to like let go of control so I just panicked and I just freaked out I was like moving and oh my God the more I resisted then it went away like a scared animal and then when I relaxed again it came back and then I was like you know I kept me out of it get me out of it and then they can't get you out of it because once you drink the cup you're in it for the ride so yeah

that's it but anyways the buckle up there's no I mean so so I just it felt like dying and not to scare anyone but it just felt like dying it was just turning twisting and then I went outside the tent and I just you know vomited on the grass because of the Persian purging yeah and so many things were happening like one of the one of the guests was like a guy from uh from Saudi Arabia and he was uh he was pretty uh he was a specialist basically and he he did it himself he goes to Peru he

buys the Ayahuasca and he does ceremonies here you get me you know this is just that because of the the culture they just you know people are doing it they're a part of it but they're not you know it's not at that kind of uh the the the publicized because of the culture because most people demit Haram so it's illegal as well yeah because of the legality issues yeah yeah yeah so anyways I just uh I went in and I just I I I I wanted to get off the island I was like give me my phone so I can call my mother how long are you into

this now how long are you at this stage how many hours into you it's uh four four to six hours no how no where you're at this no way you're at this point how many hours are you in you know what you're saying I I was only in for uh this was about an hour in one hour in okay yeah one hour in yeah yeah so anyways um I I went into a separate room and um and then I could just feel it like some type of of uh of of deep healing like and I could hear a voice it's like it just said uh relax I'm relaxed like I

I heard its intention and uh then I just I could see a blinking light like it showed me kind of my my my nervous system where and it was fixing my nerves and I could physically feel it you know deep down inside I could feel it repairing my like fixing something that was broken wow so yeah it was so crazy I was like oh my God it's so beautiful look at what he's doing he's helping me blah blah and the helper was was lying next to me uh and uh yes and after that I was just my ego just broke I just cried cried cried and

and some trauma maybe from childhood came up Etc and I was just talking and and that's when I realized okay it had broken down the layers of of of Egos and all the narratives and you know the self that you build up yeah over years it had peeled them off and then I just felt connected with everything uh alive like I just felt the pure love for everything the ego was just had to dissolve it's something you know what I'm saying you know yeah it dissolves the sensation of Love yeah that person has for eign

I just wanted to love it didn't matter anymore and and it doesn't and also it doesn't make sense like you think like you almost feel sorry that why do people have hate yeah like you think yeah like what that they should just be love like I don't understand why people are like they're hurting themselves by carrot here yeah yeah we're hurting ourselves yeah and it's like you you feel the pain for them like for for being for people that Harbor hate and you're thinking but this is harming you yeah

it's it's it's amazing how the wow so okay and so I had just become a person I I I wasn't like you you've just become someone that you aren't really in essence so yeah I mean uh anyways when I came back it was just so overwhelming and um did you did you have any complete out of body uh experience like that did you feel no did you close your eyes and I I like yeah yeah I I I I I I I lied down and I closed my eyes but it wasn't an out of

body experience but I could feel it did feel like something alien uh something outside of of of your of course of course of course so I can't really explain what it is but no you can't you can't put it into words it was an Intel I felt like it was an intelligent Force but it's it's hard to it's hard you know this is the thing the things that did you uh see things and I saw my um because my grandfather he passed away um uh six months ago during Corona and I

just uh I didn't really get to uh I didn't really get to mourn him sit around we couldn't really go there because of the coronal restrictions as he died so I guess there was something that was unresolved in my chest or my heart or whatever but I saw his home uh in Morocco Etc and uh up in the mountains so I just felt he was at peace I just got an overwhelming sense that okay he's okay he's part of everything uh yeah you know that that feeling of being connected with everything that there is a connection between us all yeah he's yeah I felt it felt really connected

deeply with with every living uh with every living organism like like it's like it's like you tap into a network of everything that is alive you just feel connected and you know this thing see did you have many other did you have many visuals as well or like um colors they see things they no I just used in the beginning no when it when it when it's when it started when it was trying to to enter you basically on a deep level it was it it was just a picture of uh creeping in creeping in and just I couldn't really

visualize something but I was thinking like roots yeah like like grass like like like taking like yeah like kind of creeping in on you consuming you almost assuming yeah yeah yeah like a death doing it yeah like a death like like a death like a part of death and it's like it was so hard to let go of control it was so terrifying it was like oh my God I'm gonna die here this is why you know I asked yeah that at the beginning that did you do anything before you did it like did you ever do any mushrooms or anything because yeah it's such an advanced thing

to to to kind of embark on and yeah it's because it's and if a person's never experienced letting go and submitting yeah they've never truly submitted and and surrendered and they take a deep dive into something like this I mean I suppose once you've taken the dive here you know it's like once you jump well gravity is going to do what it's going to do now so it's not turning back but but it's it's you know it's it's scary as hell so I'm yeah I was thinking wow okay

but uh yeah and then you know when I came back the important part of the story is probably the work after so wow uh I could walk around I didn't have any hatred or negative thoughts or anxiety or anything but it was it was amazing and I could just you know I could I I could hug my family members I could hug my mother kiss her say I love you and this and and I see something and you know it seems afterwards that what is all these things what is all this fighting and all this thing of this Dunya about like why are we wasting our energy it's so pointless

isn't it and it feels so it's so pointless yeah at that time and it really feels like yeah and you just wish you could ex show it to people how pointless this pettiness is doesn't mean anything you know it's like somebody asked earlier on today about uh they said uh oh you know I've got these this group and this sectarianism and the salafis and I've got the ahmadis and I've got these and I've got and you want to explain to people that look this all this infighting all this yeah it doesn't mean anything you know like what is that yeah you go yeah the ego is just a crazy

thing right it's really because beneath it all beneath all the layers is just you just have love for everything I think most people are like this it's amazing you know what I mean it's just layers we've built up and some some people you know from a psychological perspective they say that one theory is that you see at our core in Sun would be or this is from a psychological perspective that humans would be so connected with all forms of life because look life like

plants animals humans we at a core level are all connected through DNA like we have the same like obviously we're more you know we're different we're not part of the plant kingdom but but we have some relation of life and it's interesting how Allah says in the Quran that you know it is from that that if all of life it had one point of origin from this kind of uh primordial liquid now this primordial uh soup of life or

whatever it is so we we are have some connection now one theory of psychology says that in human beings in order to survive right it needed to reinforce this notion of the ego because it needed to kill it needed to hunt it needed to and you couldn't do it with that much compassion and empathy for where and that much love because it would kill you to kill

the the you know the prey so yeah so the human needed this isolated ego to survive because it needed to hunt and it needed to and to do that he needed to separate itself that this is me and that's not me and I can kill it because I need to do you see at a very brutal survival level and yeah it's interesting that you see because ultimately because because this is that you know Allah has created us but we have that feeling

but we also asked a queen and in Sun I don't know it's our it's our journey in between I guess if we can find that but once once found you know just just even just having that this is what the mystics called Valk that it's only something you you know you said I can't explain it in words because it's from though it's from it's what the mystics call the you know the sufia they these people would call it the Volk that it's you can only taste it it's experiential you can't put these

things into words that kind of love that kind of um compassion but yeah it's um so wow okay that's that's something man yeah it's yeah I just wanted to share it and just like get your perspective on it because uh I probably wouldn't have done it if I didn't got the the green light if you haven't yeah I think you know it's interesting that look people see it differently my perspective is this look there will be many people who feel that this is Haram

okay that's fine they should not do it then okay because to them this is Haram that's fine I do have a video where I highlight that look to that this is not Haram based on these and people can disagree that's okay you know it's okay if they you know like in the methods I have a video showing all the kind of meat that different methods believe is Haram like Accord uh apart from docile animals everything is Haram and according to one end of the Maliki method apart from Pig nothing is Haram so you know whether a person who's eating tiger meat or crocodile meat or

Eagles or anything it's not Haram so according to the other thing almost everything apart from poultry and you know beef and this and that is everything else is almost Haram so you have and the point is what you follow is your Devotion to God now there is this Hadith that Allah has not you know that there is not there is not in an ill an ailment or a disease or a sickness of any sort

including anxiety including depression including there is none of these things except Allah has has sent revealed in nature until away in nature and there is a shifa for it in some herb in some plant in some fruit and then the Hadith says

whosoever came to know of it came to know of it whosoever did not come to honor of it did not come to know of it except malt everything else it will have something to be discovered and this I feel is you know it's an amazing part of nature which Allah is from Allah you know it's not these things and and I feel that he a it's difficult for an atheist to experience this and come back an atheist

it's you know to me that good luck people it's very difficult yeah and and and tell me this is you know when people say people say Eunice oh but it's just in your mind yeah good I mean yeah I mean you say well you know you say I'm not so sure about that because I know what right now I've got things in my mind yeah I dream let's say every night I know what dreams feel like yeah I know what daydreaming feels like I know what imagining things feels like yeah and I

know what the world feels like and this feels more real than real so what am I supposed to do with it yeah yeah there's yeah no and what about the the clarity and you know and something that is a source of love and peace and you know it's true because you I I said once and you know I was saying it ingest but I'm saying it as a joke but I was you know there was a hint of uh truthfulness to it I said that it should really be mandatory for

all world leaders to to to to take this you know sacred medicine because the world would be a different place definitely you know you you imagine imagine Putin had taken it was on you know the truth is you you don't you don't the world changes for a person they don't want to harm people they don't want to they know they want to be a source of love for people they want to in fact they they feel you know what their

empathy increases when they see people suffering it it hurts them and it hurts them so much like even to see them doing wrong which that person isn't obviously in a state of suffering they're just hateful about something it hurts this to put people to see it because they think that man they they're harming themselves by having by being a source of hate so yeah exactly that's that's the thing about it all is that the hate the anger the hostility it only it only hurts yourself that's the problem

yeah and and people we we do it when we try to as a defense mechanism when people you know heard us and stuff like that and we experience bad things so we do these things in order to protect ourselves but the problem ultimately is that uh we end up hurting ourselves become because we become distant from from who we really are that that core you know that as you as you said the the essence of Love Etc so you just you you risk ending up becoming a person that that you are not really that you aren't really so that's that's what the medicine does

it it shows you who you really are yeah so and and I and I get it I I got into a discussion recently with um um with this a retired doctor this lady uh non-muslim and we spoke about this and she'd worked in palliative care as well and she wasn't in a fan of psychedelics and she and it's interesting the term psychedelics because it means mind expanding mind opening and so well and she and she said well look you

know I advocate other methods like meditation and mindfulness and all of that and and I just want to say I agree that this you see look whatever makes the person a better person um you know if to some people it's they can they can achieve it through mindfulness and just doing the general things and I shared a Hadith today which really sums up Islam about this whole thing of love it's really that whole Hadith could be summed up by love that you know Allah as long as you

are set you you you you you are taking a footstep in aiding someone in need that God is aiding you that as soon as that the most beloved of actions is that just bringing some happiness to the hearts of another person that you know repelling some agony from somebody that's suffering at the heart at the Crux of that entire Hadith is just this it's just love and so however a person can self-actualize you know if a person can do it in other ways then of course and

this isn't I'm not trying to say to people and I I don't say to people that look everybody should be doing this and um because it is you know it's like you said look you went to to do it and it took a great amount of courage and a great amount of strength because it was terrifying yeah and and I've heard uh sometimes you know there's the odd cases I've uh you you can get on YouTube in in some among some of the research sorry you'll get some of the um researchers mentioned especially if people have a history of mental health like by mental health I mean psychosis

yeah then sometimes it can be it can be dangerous for them because if people have mental health like schizophrenia in the family or they hear voices and um then for you see because for people like that the very little sense the kind of semblance of reality that they have for that to dissolve it becomes too difficult for it to come back together and and it's too terrifying so it it would be devastating for people like that to take it yeah but and so these

things are not for everyone but at the same time I do feel that it's a shame that the you know certain cultures even the you know the West the Western cultures because of Nixon's war on terror um still continue to Outlaw uh these kind of things that can really help people heal and have led so many people back to God yeah you know in this day and age I really feel that this path of consciousness is what is leading so many people back to God

in a you know in an age of hard line materialistic or a mechanistic materialism it is this path of Consciousness that is breaking the way through it for your common people out there not Muslims for the common people out there and it is forcing away back to God because it's difficult not to believe after you taste an experience that the presence of God that you feel that difficult

but yeah but I'm really grateful Eunice that you came on and shared your experience it's uh of course sitting right there in the jungle you took us right there with me yeah it's been quite a night on that on that Pleasant thought I think we should wrap this up yeah thank you so much Mufti

yeah people that was Eunice all the way from ah was it from Amsterdam I believe but yeah well shukran all the way from the mainland continent from the jungle right there sharing his uh precious Thoughts with us people it's been quite a um I can see quite an evening uh let's wrap this up for tonight uh very fruitful discussion do take these you know one of the the most uh the key words really the key phrases sorry that Eunice had said and I remind

people that look you are your own person okay um he said that look when he was interested he researched something and a person always they have their own they have their own path in front of them that they have to they have to walk in life I guess and if you're somebody that does hold to the opinion that these things are Haram I respect that opinion I understand

where you're coming from um you're coming from the angle that to to kind of dissolve any sense of reality in front of you to you maybe akin to intoxication uh and I respect that although I respectfully disagree with it but I respect that opinion and I believe in that case you should not do these things and to you it is Hana um but equally we need to respect a difference of opinion and that is honestly it is the the the beautiful

diversity of Islam that it shows us these incredibly different and diverse colors I mean I mean and you know it's it's a journey online and we're all on it and we're all learning I can't remember I said to who was I saying we're all developing yeah you know I to speaking to someone recent which is yesterday day before yesterday I was talking about something I was talking to talking about myself and I I said look like what like what will it be

if we didn't develop I said like I I look at myself even and I think you know I see some things of myself and I think you know what an idiot [Laughter] you know we we developed this is the the fruits of life that we walk at this path we grow we develop we learn we um and we kind of have patience with one another along the way we're all everybody's fighting a difficult part may Allah bless everyone you know may he give us all happiness I mean and may He

you know more importantly allow us to be a source of happiness for others there is something so profound about just being able to bring a glimpse of happiness in a moment of another that you are for albeit a moment a piece of sunshine in somebody's world may Allah enable us all to do that and to truly

um understand this thing you know as by the messenger rahmatullah that you know it was a mercy that Allah says in Allah if you had this harshness to you they would have fled from around you you know they you you wouldn't see these people but you weren't you

people I'll leave you with that if you want to reach out to me send me a message on Instagram I do try to respond uh as quick as I I do try on Instagram if you if you want a more personal uh interaction if you want to take up the one-to-one perspective sessions I have and then that's available on patreon there are different tiers uh there is the one-to-one perspective session there is just there's other benefits on patreon with different tiers subscribe tears there is

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