Meetup - Between Talk & Thoughts - Mufti Abu Layth

allum all right let's let's get this show on the road allahar right I'll just wait for people to to be present with the Barakat all right

so all right you know it's been in quite a while hadn't met up with some of you w so I thought you know what let's have a let's share some thoughts and some talk right so let's see who do we have Leo Mitchell

Leo Benjamin likewise clear as always uh right fimos alos all right is that your real name or it's I like the Rhythm you've got going there allahar Brian go goam people Quicks silver miss the old muy hi hi hi I'm Han old I am

old you know somebody said to me they said Muti you know you should um come live and the Q&A like hold and I said all that stuff is still there you know the questions have been answered I mean what am I you know there are no new questions are there it's all Allah more importantly you know there is a stage and an age you know they

say Allah that there is a time and a place if you like for and and one could maybe rephrase it better as in there is a you know there is a stage yeah for each thing in life I guess so what is going on I'm a Quran only Muslim Benjamin 786 I love you Allah bless you and I have love for you to are of course in good manners and

Vibe Allah bless you it's often I feel these things you know this I think the Quran only argument you see most arguments in Islam they stem from most maybe not all but most stem from a place of love for the dean now how accurate are they is another question because not everything that one is is anchoring in a sense of Love is

always rightly anchored or placed sometimes you know we we get things wrong in the process as well and I feel that one of the things about the Quran only is that there is a um you see there is a an epistemology that they are worried about that how can we prove something belongs that the prophet actually said it and that in and of itself is you know that's an um an admirable love and concern for

the dean that is that somebody is you know they they have such a high regard for our de that they do not wish for any contaminants to affect it but that said you see that said what happens along the way is that that is not the you know the way to go about it though to dismiss all of the Sunnah and to

you know to somehow you know just to so much beauty of the them escapes us if we were to take such a you know such a route but yeah right your video which critiqued sah bukari was interesting yeah I mean it is it is interesting you know there's um I guess you know the whole bukari

question it's not want to dismiss sari that's not been my kind of point or objection but my point was to say that in Islam the Quran the dean is Quran Centric so you know take the analogy of the solar system then the sun is the Quran and so it's not like saying there's a hierarchical

structure that the sun is the Quran it is the foundation upon which this entire Deen is built now the Sunnah however what is these uh it's my earphones are going off about something so the but the Sunnah is equally a it is a very incredibly enriching and nourishing source that we have you know you could we can't really do without it in

the sense of what the dean but it's not to be understood in a way that you see a better way to understand it is to distinguish between Hadith andah the Sunnah is always but not every Hadith is a Sunnah and that's the way that Imam Malik understood this thinge that's the way that Imam Abu hanifah understood this theme that is the way that we generally the majority of the Muslims have understood this thing um there is

naturally there there's other ways and mhbs you know this the maab of IMA who didn't necessarily understand it in that way and you know the the maab of other Hadith um kind of textualists in a way that they they don't understand understand it in that way but yeah but to throw the you know it does not mean so I was not trying to say that buari is not admissible I was saying

that Alli are admissible but you evaluate them with the three you know the [Music] that it doesn't go against the whole um you know reason because the de does not go against the voice of reason um it does not clash with the the of this theme which is the

Quran and the you know the broad kind you know Theo that we have well and and it doesn't uproot Ani principle of Islam so that's what I was saying right now isbar Abu hanifa or [Music] not yeah well you know being IM abu's book right so realistically it's not going to be uh IM Abu hanif's book like just being

realistic although many of the teachings within it may be transmitted from the Imam as a legacy that and there's been much study on this and you can look into that that was the a uh was it actually Imam Abu hanifa I think it's very unlikely at that stage nobody was really authoring on AKA so

yeah and so and and one of the strongest um indications that it is not a uh work of Imam Abu hanifah himself although the opinions maybe um you know the opinions themselves uh maybe um for the most part attributed to Imam Abu hanifah so they may be but the book isn't itself now and there's a few themes in that amongst them the discussion of

karamat because this term karamat is a much later development of the Muslim discourse so you wouldn't really have a book discussing something precociously before whether the the theme you know notion existed or not but the word the must the kind of nenat did not exist so yeah every time now this is this is it isn't it every time most of I've answered all of these questions so you can see why this is really for the most part pointless for me and why I

don't engage these discussions anymore because I have just answered all of these time and time again um all right why is my why is this freezing all right um wow okay should we um I can share the link and we can have

some people you can you know you can join the um live stream have I studied the F we had to study part parts of it during our

Muti e

e e all

right people I take it I don't know I think I may have accidentally knocked something and disconnected the internet either that or it was a sign uh all right so I take it I'll just let the system I'll just if I type Salam does it go through let's see um yep it's gone through okay we are back so I don't know I I think I may have accidentally disconnected it or it disc

connected in any case right so let's share the the link let's have a little chat with some of you [Music] and right okay

okay um all right I'll let people there you go I've shared the link did that not get let me see is it disconnected no there it is it is shared all right so I'll let you guys if you want to jump on but you just you must uh activate your mic and camera and right it got shared sh

all right so who do we have here what is going on with the PC Today safe yah safe how are you alhamdulillah alhamd what about you how are you safe I think I have to turn off the the YouTube app because I'm hearing your voice twice all right okay I hear you clearly now how are you how

is everything with you Allah be praised you know it's um it's it's always good you know it's always good Allah we friends of you here my wife is standing there in the background she's giving me thumbs up like you finally join mu's life well Allah bless you both a mean

I uh I have had this question saved in my notes for literally since Ramadan so that's been like many months that I wanted to ask you I wanted to join you on live and ask you this question because uh I feel like it's very important for me okay right let's uh let's let's this this question that's been stored up since Ramadan has been s this has been s for years to be honest with you and I I asked you on in Stam DM once we have been in touch on Instagram DMS a few times I've asked you questions but I understand you know you cannot share

your uh full thoughts on an Instagram DM but uh I thought you know save it for life so the um Can can benefit from this question yes Salam or not or maybe maybe I will cause some problems in the um who knows well all right safe so go on then time for you to unath that sword unleash it on this ready I've been ready for many months man the question is about the very

specific part of the Ayah inah Bak which is one second please so um obviously the Ayah is talking about the of Ramadan so and then it goes on to say if somebody is sick or he's traveling uh then they can do the fast on another day I obviously I know you know all these things but I'm saying it just in case other people are no it's good it's good please please do yeah

please do yeah please so the verse says that translates that you know uh fasting has been made mandatory upon you just as it has been made on previous uh and then it says so this is the part where I have the question roughly translates that uh so I already mentioned that people who are sick or traveling they can do the fast

on another day so we all know that everybody knows that if you're sick or you're traveling you don't fast on that specific day and you fast on another day which I understand it from my basic reading as it says that people who are not sick and who are not traveling and they are able to fast but choose not to they can instead pay a fidya for somebody and the as far as I understand it is basically feeding a poor person on every day that you choose not to fast so and then the Ayah goes on to

say which again I believe it says that rough translation again uh and who chooses to fast it is better for you to fast rather than to pay and feed a poor person I believe it means that if you do both it's even better I I again I mean it can do I mean the verse yeah I mean it's generic but you're right you could fit it on that as well I mean it could be understood in a sense of to mean uh like something which

is extra it could be understood like that it could also be understood um from the angle from that whoever adopted a sense of worship as a goodness but generally you're right if you're taking it the other way you do both so you're seeing it as here as in to mean to kind of charitably do something extra like a you know like in yes so yeah okay yeah I understand m so the I have heard so many opinions on

this topic some people say that this is not even referring to Ramadan this is referring to which was before Ramadan fasting was made mandatory and some people say that the next Ayah which is Ayah verse 185 uh basically basically which means the ring has I don't know how to explain in English to be honest with you English is not my first language as you can tell like an abrogation or okay aration I've never heard that word first time oh yeah yeah

yeah they use it generally for the word n abrogation to abrogate right okay so I'm somebody that does not accept and in in religion just I can go into that that's a very large and it's going to be too long to listen to um I wanted to hear your thoughts on this so the AY is very clearly some uh Scholars have tried to say that it says for whatever reason they added the I don't know I don't know where that

came from to be honest the B gramians A lot of them I don't know B have done a few interesting things over the you know over the course of our religion but I just wanted to hear your thoughts on this what is I've I've done this a few times to be honest with you where there's been days in Ramadan where I just instead of fasting I paid FIA I have uh for whatever reason my wife thinks I'm a Muti myself and every time she has a question she asks me and I tell her that this is what I do but I don't know if this is 100% true or not

I'm just doing what I think is right if you want to do it do it I'm not going to be answering on your behalf on day of judgment so wanted to hear your thoughts yeah so right the ruling in general so looking at the ruling and looking at the journey and the development of this verse throughout um you know just stages or or different uh viewpoints of so generally speaking the popular opinion one will

find from people is that which the BOS gramians have put forward in saying that the LA nafia the negating LA is missing this is what they the grians uh try to argue that here Allah is saying MKE that and upon those or as to those who are capable then they may give but do not fast they may give fidya they say that what is being said here is that and upon

those or as to those who are not capable who aren't capable so just as in English how you have this um you know this kind of apostrophe and certain things subdued so they're saying the entire La particle has been dropped here you know this this can I just add one one little Point here there is another verse in the Quran which uses the word which

is so yeah there is the LA there that is used why wouldn't God use it in this verse as well no I mean la simply is the um you know the negating particles or as in English to say not or don't I won't I you know I'm not going I won't do this just so to just put the negative it's used right throughout the Quran all the time in you know whenever something is being negated or you're using a negative uh it's it's a standard language I mean there nothing special to do with Arabic it's in every language if I'm going to I'm not going you won't do this I will

not it's just using that the question that this has been suppressed and dropped if we pause for a moment the verse and put it to a side and semantically look at that discussion just semantically and from a linguistic perspective it is it is a very weak argument that such because the negating article is so Cru IAL in what it's trying to say so if I said to you you know I I'm going and I said oh when I said I'm going I I meant to say I'm

not going but oh didn't you understand I dropped the not but that's that changes everything so it's not it's not like just you've dropped something Superfluous so sometimes you drop particles like and it can be suppressed you know after or things like this where you know like in English sometimes to with uh these things but to to drop the entire negative particle this doesn't really make any sense from a linguistic perspective because you would entirely switch the meaning so it's not something obvious you know when I say to you oh but that's

obvious it's not obvious so not repeating a pronoun may be obvious if we know who's who we're talking about you know who who does this go back to when I say oh he said this and you you know you understand oh who I'm talking about and I don't repeat the name but to miss this out to Omit this this Omission linguistically it comes across very weak okay as a linguistic argument that said it's probably the most popular transmission now the question here is why is this the most popular transmission because you know linguistically it's the weakest and the reason being is that

they work they reverse engineering it so the scholars and then I'll come back to the other ways of looking at the meaning so the scholars generally have you see this comes back to a kind of spirit and on ontology our understanding of the dean the generally have taken a very strict um approach when it comes to others in when it comes to others uh you know

addressing people you know when I'm speaking to them this is one of the teachings that you know extremely highlights that what people have missed is this massive you know this this kind of Universe of rahma that they although everybody accepts rahma yes but when it comes to exercising this or to showing channeling the Quran in the light of rahma a lot of

have really been very weary in doing that and like overall there'll be elements of rahma that they you know Allah is rman rman but when it comes to rulings or Commandments you'll find if there's a choice let's say you could do this or you could do this they will opt for the stricter you know they will opt the more and if you read the fatawa books they will say they will justify it and you know it's not like we will think best of them Allah knows the hearts yeah like it's not you know we don't know

what a person's intention is but you know we'll we'll go with the best give them the benefit of the not only the benefit of the doubt but the best of intentions will assume and the rest Allah knows so they argue that oh if you give you know the principle of if you give an inch they'll take a mile so they you know they they run with this principle that if I make something a bit relaxed for you you're going to make it super relaxed so you the aam won't know how to safeguard the limit so almost as a safety measure I'm going to come out with the most you know the most

strictest of rulings for you to help you now this principle that I give I give the fwa with the most you know the most this really you know even if the Nia is good like let's say the near of these is good but it is not the characteristic of the prophet sallallah alaih wasallam who when in theith inar when said that the prophet was never

presented a choice except he chose the one with most ease like he was always about ease you know the prophet said that that the best of your Dean is the most that with the most ease Allah repeatedly you know almost every single Surah Surah Toba Begins by reminding us rman rman rman and even though we all know this but when it comes to practice we become like we micromanage we say

that you know what like people say I'm okay with it because I know I this is the attitude that look I'm okay with it but if I tell you you you you can't be trusted to right to be kind of now so this is why they then reverse engineered so they've taken that they've got that spirit so they ruling is that look no we're not going to say that if you're capable you can choose not to fast so we're going to say that that's a no ghost but here we've got a verse of the Quran though so what do we do so now we reverse engine so we have the meaning

first now we make the verse of the Quran fit the meaning right as opposed to taking the verse of the Quran first and then finding the meaning so they already have the meaning so they already know that no we're not going to let normal people just find an excuse to not fast or like let's say or some people as long as you know if they're not M or or something then no now and that is a theme right throughout so for example you've got the Hadith that which is in sah Muslim that and it's I mean it's in many other books as well like the m and other books that the prophet he combined between

prayers yes and in another right yes so it's in abbas's narration I believe they may be another narration as well from another companion but there's so the point is the prophet he combined between prayers without there being any fear without there being a journey and in one narration without there being rainfall now when when I Abbas is in a particular there's a narration in sah Muslim where Abbas is giving a speech and somebody says to him yeah

abas you need to hurry up we're we're getting late for Salah right so he says to him that look just keep your cool don't worry like you know like I like this Dean is very beloved to me like you know you don't need to teach me and what happen happens is he carries on with his speech and then he afterwards combines and he says that look the prophet would combine um between the Salah so and when he's asked but why would the prophet do it then if it wasn't he said he wanted his um to have

convenience now you take this ruling with the exception of some very few people um you have some obviously you've got the like you have some like then you have some malikia like asab and uh but but generally you will not get uh you know anybody giving you the ruling that you are allowed to practice this even though it's aahi you know it's um because they they have the you're coming back to that you know they

wearing that cap that no if we say that people will so this is the Outlook that's determining the ruling now we come back to this verse so you come back to this verse now okay how did people like abas what is transmitted from companions like AB that this verse is referring to people who are not exactly sick they're not uh Travelers but they have a form of inconvenience to a

certain sort of A Sort now it's left open now the examples that are transmitted from abas andar is like um a pregnant woman or a mother that is nursing her child now the these examples are given that they can just choose not to fast but they don't need to make up for it either right but they have to feed a they give fidya yeah so they give fidya but they don't have to make up for the fast so you know because other people will say sure you know like if you've

got that excuse you still make up for it so they've used this verse in its actual reading these companions to say that it is valid so there's a kind of inconvenience that is you know it's but you're not exactly a sick person you're not exactly a traveler but you've got something else that's going on and ra that's you know creating a hindrance to do with fasting but you could if you wanted to but it might cause some and for that reason you don't fast and you give the fya and you don't have to they

don't have to make it up now so that the ruling in general okay so now that said people generally don't understand this to mean that um like they don't bring it down to just a mood thing like you know if a person just said like I'm not in the mood to fast um they would say that there's something inconveniencing the person but if they were to you know put their foot down maybe they could with some kind of immense or with some kind of like a

struggle do it but because of this thing then they're not going to fast and they give a fidya instead now so that's how that reading of it is um you know through those companions like and but uh most people don't actually go with that so you won't find that in most of the books they'll just say that it's you know this is a suppression um they'll also say maybe it's for people who are really old and they can't fast so but really old and if you can't fast then you don't

really need then the fidya you know it shouldn't really be an obligation Because unless you were old but you could fast if you with a struggle but you chose not to then yes this verse could fit them but not really old like if you were really old that fasting wasn't an option really as in it was just going to be very harmful to your health then the verse wouldn't really apply to you so but you will get a lot of the T saying that people who are like you know the she that is really old and so on so I hope that you know I've tried to tie that in the the whole reading yeah mu I'm just going to put

you on the spot man um you you've given a very good uh background about why they say that the you know why the mainstream opinion is the way that it is but I want to hear your opinion of it I want to hear what you think of it no I would my understanding would be like the the way I find myself inclined is like with the teachings of those companions it's with it is with this you know this rahma principle of I would

however okay so there's a difference I wouldn't you see I I would not personally agree with it just being a mood thing in the sense of like uh you know I'm not in the mood I wouldn't because there is an art to discipline and it does bring about a certain it brings about a lot of in us uh but that said there could be something that is you know somebody's got something going on so you know people today have the question of like they've got an exam yeah yeah and I've got an exam and

you know uh like like let's say some person like to some people they might think well I don't care I've got an exam I can fast in fact I think even clearer with uh a fast to some people they might feel no you know I get headaches I get or I triggers a migraine or you know I can't do it it's really important I'm not you know I've got this these exams going on during this week I'm not going to fast I would feel that this allows them that dispensation um something like somebody for example a doctor you know he had surgery he needed something he's like no you know I need some I need to be alert

I need to take something to make myself super alert and so I would leave it open I'm not going to narrow it to that but I would not personally agree with it just being a mood thing I wouldn't say like you know if somebody said I'm not in the mood I would say no that that doesn't qualify but if there was like if a person felt a now this is the interest this is an important factor in of sh you'll find that the distinguish things into three categories yeah so they have the they have

the and the so these two things we're going to look at so people will all agree that you don't need to fast if it was a like if a person you know themselves was about to have surgery or if something you know they said no you need to have this for your doctor said it and you and you took it all will agree with that that that's fine it's a it's something which is a necessity the second stage they won't really accept which is a ha it's a need but it's not a necess

necessity this verse would then cater based on the circumstance on need on a need basis for somebody it's not you know by its Mercy it's left undefined now so it's not cosmetic it's notat it's not about you know just pure Cosmetics or like I'm not in the mood or something but it's a hajah there could be some hajah going on some person someday you know maybe he's you know his his health he's feeling you know I'm not actually drastically ill but you know he

just feels he can't you know my like I I can't fast today you know there's my whatever it is like to some you see even Health sorry sickness there's some sickness which is universally everybody will accept it's crippling but then there's a spectrum you see to some person a headache might not be to many of us it might be nothing you know might think oh what's a headache I have a headache every other to some person it could be you know oh like I can't take it I need to drink water I need to you know my dehydration's affecting me I'm going to open the fast based on this now that is their

call this is something IM sh puts them as says look you know better about yourself you have to remember that look Allah is you know watchful and you are answerable to God now you can make yourself responsible and do something if you feel that look you know what this is too much like oh my God my throat I need to I need to drink something TK if that's your I would I recommend in those circumstances that you make up those fasts this would be my thing that I would say that if it's something like that they you've just had to break it because you know you got this headache

you make up for it so this is what I would say now if you see the question does this yes so yeah so that would answer it that's where I would see myself with this verse that this would be discussing haiat haat and it would allow people to open the fast or to not fast based on that even if they weren't a traveler but according to me I would still say if it's one of these kind of haat they should make up for it right um yeah so that's how I would as a person see it that they should then make

that up at a later date fair enough man finally I I can take this question of my my notes it's been it's been stored there for many many months you know but I would like to Circle back to this point of Mercy it is such a big point that um you know IM IM continuously comes back to that it is something that we don't really um you know we don't

truly grasp and there's a I'll you know at another time I'll go over this maybe in much detail um that wasi is inform l or notoriously he's he's been you know he has a point of controversy which is the Iman of okay and you know if you read his thing it people have so misunderstood it because if you look at the verses of the Quran they are you know the verses a lot of Scholars have said this you know if

you look at the verse they are at you know this there there's both sides of the argument now generally people may say look I don't of course mainstream view is that dies a cafir rejecting but the verse of the Quran says that he says that to M that I believe I have believed in the Lord you know what you and Banu Isel believe in The Lord of you know your lord and the Lord of Banu Isel he says that now the question here is he says it but he's

seen this punishment in front of him of God so can Iman be accepted when we see the punishment of God now the general understanding that a lot of would say is that no but when you look at a verse of the Quran it speaks that you know there's a verse that there was not a there was not um except when they you know when they saw saw our punishment it was too

late Allah says except the people of Unice we forgave them so because they you know what happened is when Jonah left unus alisam left they realized damn you know what the punishment started to come and they actually he he must have been a man of God so they came out flocked out you know in the crowds they the elderly the young the men the women they all flocked out to this open space and they cried out to Allah and Allah says that you know there's in in the verse that there

was not a people who when they denied the message and the punishment came except it was too late you except the people of unas we actually forgave them now you see so here you get this both sides of the argument that look if Allah wants he can you know apprehend a situation with his mercy and you do have a verse of the Quran that Fon says I now believe in in you know in your lord and the Lord of but what's fascinating P all this topic

aside you know whether F believed or not is irrelevant to an extent we all know the Quran says he did believe but maybe it was too late right the point is that you know this verse is such a you know such a mesmerizing w t of this verse of the Quran that you know if only W these are the things that you know make me honestly like my soul kind of it glows and why I was so drawn to this this whole you know the the message of this you know great

man this overall he has now you know this verse that so Allah is addressing the Pharaoh that today we save you with your body so that you may be a sign or this you know you may be a sign for those who come

after yet most people are heedless they don't take like despite us putting a sign there they don't grasp it now AR says that that I want you to check this out his analysis whether we agree with it or not you know somebody this doesn't mean that you have to agree with his analysis on this point but just look at the broad theme of what he's saying he says that you know this what is this Ayah that we save you so you may be an A so there may be this sign of God what is this sign so the sign he says many people believe it to be that if you

do wrong you will be punished MH he says that but then Allah follows up by saying but most people don't accept these signs when we show them Arabi says but most people do have a belief that if you do wrong you will be punished right he says like when you speak to Common People most common people whether they in their heart of hearts do believe this that you know those who do wrong Allah will catch them one day they will be

punished he says but ah the a of Mercy that even though you were the worst of the worst the scum you know you de declared yourself a rival to Allah you tortured innocent people you murdered but when you open your heart at that final near-death experience Allah's Mercy was that vast that it still apprehended you but yet

most people do not see the mercy of Allah in that way right yeah it was honestly this theme that is putting forward whether people agree with this topic of or not it's irrelevant but this theme that he's putting forward it is so beautifully mesmerizing that most people do not unfortunately see such mercy of Allah like they do believe in the mercy but they don't they

are heedless of that great sign so I just found it very breathtaking I you know I thought this reminded me the theme did I thought I'll just share it briefly and maybe in a future session we can um you know I'll go over it in detail and show the verses and both sides of the arguments but I think it's you know rather than people criticizing for this view even if you disagree in The View with the you it doesn't matter like it was the theme he was trying to present he was trying to

say that you know what is this great sign it is that Allah's Mercy is so vast that people think it's vast but it's even vaster than what they think that they are heedless of this kind of radical Divine love of God but yeah safe it's been a pleasure speaking to you thank you very much for the time and for the answer very welcome I hope other people can benefit from this I know that I benefit from you it's been six years

since I discovered Muti AB 2018 I was on a trip about four five hours drive and I actually found you on Soundcloud not YouTube at the time oh wow you know I've got to put myff on the AIO sorry rep I've got to put my stuff on the other kind of platforms I've been so distracted and maybe just lazy is the real word but inshallah you know I will I will do that you know I I've been meaning to do some of these

things I guess you know it's like life gets in the way does we get distracted but but inshallah this hope hopefully I'll find the motivation to get it done inshah thank you very much mu enjoy your the rest of your day and Allah bless likewise so shukran to you and the misses over there as well the wife Allah bless you both and take care of yourself allum people that was safe I believe he said from the Netherlands I may have uh got that wrong

now but but uh so what an amazing discussion and conversation wow yeah right let me you know what let me try and bring on we've got here we got we've got what is that theral memba let me

thero mum how are you I'm good I'm good how are you look at that see with the gaming earphones right there I love it I love it uh it is uh so so that you can you can read it on my face on my face that I am a gamer I can y you're giving the profile is right there you see I can feel the Aura that's it you're a gamer I like it I like it well you know the the such is the life of this this D it is a game as

well you know yeah it's a it's a game I think yeah it's an illusion and a game it is it ision how how have you been yeah I'm yeah I'm good I'm good I'm good I'm good good I just I I I won't be I won't be uh long today sure just I just I just I just have a like uh there there were uh something that I wanted to to talk about and it is uh and and I was it is uh something that maybe a lot of people will benefit it is the audio platforms thing because sa

just said it but yeah I think that it is very good would be very good to have your content uh maybe a podcast I don't know uh yeah yeah no I can I need to put all of these all of this content up on there I I think I need a bit of help with it you know so people those of you that watch this and if you're uh you know a bit skilled and and You've Got Time time and effort prepared to reach out to me and yeah you know I I think I need to do it the time is nigh you know it's here yeah I need to inshallah yeah yeah it would be it would

be very good very very good so I I kind of have first subject that I want you to to touch upon so I will and after that I will go go to sleep I just I want I want you to touch upon it is not necessary to touch upon right now but I think that it is it is just you can you can say uh yeah yeah so yeah I want you to to continue to for the current guest was a current Quest yeah I want to do that inshallah you know I've been there's been things going on in a good way in with life and a lot of things have been going on that have

been kind of had me a bit preoccupied yeah and um but you know it's in my mind that I want to what I want to do is finish this a certain amount of videos maybe not that many but a certain amount on this Islamic psychology where I'm uh infusing the thought ofi with modern day psychology so you know it may be a few more videos yet so I wanted to yet speak about so I've spoken about a few things you know the Divine mirror stage why Allah created us um

the symbolic order I want to speak about the real the the big other um maybe a couple more on this infusing this between and modern psychology and once I've done that then I want to go back to the Quran Quest thing in yeah yeah no get this out the way because I felt you know it's like I don't know like I just felt this thing to share this um and bridge between and psychology in as Islamic psychology and

I'm kind of it's I'm you know it's strange because it's a journey in the making like I'm discovering it as I'm going going along with it and I'm you know some of it is with poetic license like I'm kind of taking certain theories of psychology and a bit of this and I'm seeing that shine here and this shine there and I'm kind of like synthesizing some things and um and so kind of representing it and so I want a certain batch on this Islamic psychology and just leave that there then for anybody who wants to benefit and as an example

like let's say I really like this three you know this kind of um Vin diagram if you like that laan had used of the imaginary the symbolic and the real but I've then tweaked that as in Taken sh's thing which I felt fitted nicely and then presented it now the real is an interesting one because that's going to be our next session is going to be on the real but you see to l the real is something to do with um like

it's I mean I I feel this it is what would be speaking about Al that really there is only Allah reality yeah and we are an EP phenomenon an emergent property but you see to often the real is like almost like a negative like it because of the it's almost like a trauma because once the imaginary and the symbolic breakway it's too traumatic but you see to me how I were I'm channeling this is actually I can understand what what you mean by this you know it's this

terrifying experience because you're getting but in that there there is a closeness to the Transcendent like we are closer to so people who experience any kind of trauma or something in that state they actually I feel are in a closer state to God because this reality is is breaking crumbling and and hence you have these duas that the Dua of a person who is going through that is is accepted and because it's like as if the veils are shattering so I will speak about but

this is me now synthesizing these views I'm not just doing you know I'm not just relaying saying oh he said this he said I'm kind of trying to fuse this this Fusion of uh so I want this Islamic psychology of you know and modern day psychology put out there and then go back to inshah yeah yeah so so yeah so about that I I just have so was the second the second subject the third subject would be the bukari after because I I I I think that you

know you know the the impacts that that the bukari gate did for many communities yeah it did a very good very I think there would be an interesting after session to do I think or like or like an you know maybe something like Beyond bukari or something what what what to think Beyond it because like

sorry yeah yeah because because some some people will say okay you did BK gate andar BK gate many people have uh you know their opinion of of of Adis changes there people who say okay now we know exactly the difference Adis andah the people said okay now I go we we B get is there okay we see that okay bukari have some error maybe maybe this time let's go let's let's just reject it like the

people are are there are people maybe they can be uh they can be sh they say oh yeah oh you know you know bukari yeah have this Christian we said you know this bukari after this so you will have say noi bhari is very strong so so there is you're right maybe like a Beyond bukari gate a Beyond yeah clarify where clarify stand and because you're right that you know bukari gate it is I I have always felt it was it is

important um but you know I feel that there is an element of post structuralism being applied sure look it's a free world people can do whatever they like but you know where they say well you know you have in poststructuralism death of the author like it it doesn't really matter what the author said or like what he meant what we mean by this so so we have this thing that well people would say well you know therefore thuso throw bukari out the and I've never said that and I've never advocated

in fact I've always respected sahkari and I've considered like you know that fine it is sah my whole point was that to remove this sacral s uh this infallibility is to say that there may be a margin of error in some Hadith but so we make a return to this Sunnah way of thinking not to say well you know there let's chuck all these Hadith out the window stuff I've never ADV ated that and so you're right it would be good to say well you know there should be a video at some point uh going into

elaborate detail on you know beyond bukari gate like where where do I find myself after let's say five years and bukar gate and you know how how do people understand it maybe this will be something in years to come people would do phds about and they'll say yeah yeah I what they'll say like what Abu really meant by it and so so so so yes the fourth so after after the book I get after I got the four four subject May the first subject may be it would be the subject beffiting

of Muti and it is a very large subject and it kind and and I kind of It kind I was thinking about it uh when the um there an interview between IM IM Hussein IM Hussein and d and d Hussein I think I don't know and yeah yeah and and that in that interview yeah yeah you watch watch you watch that that that interview you know Iman Hussein is is a guy that every time that he have an interview he speaks something and people

always will will uh say okay we are kind of good with him there are many people say okay he's a devian people we say he's a CFE here people say okay it's something is so and I and I was thinking okay who have the right in and in in Islam to point a finger and say that you are a deviant you are a Muslim you are a mus you are a so I think like I saw many

YouTuber yeah yeah say we come here do a video this guy is a devian this guy is a m this guy is a CF okay yeah so firstly I will need I I think like the people kind of need to know the difference what is aition what is a CF what is a Believer what is a Muslim what is a mush and what's the difference about all of this and how how to make sure that you can have the right stenes

to judge people and yeah the problem with that I thought you were going to say I thought I thought you were going to say that I should get a podcast with uh yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah it would be it is I actually watch that uh thing and I have to say you know this uh yeah like uh Dilly has made some some really good kind of podcasts and yeah yeah so you know he's and that was one I thoroughly enjoyed and obviously he has uh I have admired especially recently I think it's necessary the whole exposing

the whole Israel uh genocide he's done you know he's doing great work on that Allah bless him but so but this thing this you see Iman I'm not I didn't realize she Imran Hussein would be willing to you know come on podcasts and stuff yeah yeah I was I was really surprised I was really I would love to have a discussion with him I don't know if he'd want to have a discussion with me if he would I would love to I mean I'm not you know in any way you know judgmental uh I mean in in any kind of or I hope not in any kind of bigoted way and so he would be more than welcome to

discuss and I would love to elaborate on certain concepts with him I did find that you know in some of the things in that discussion with the Dil that she Imran Hussein I'm not sure where that was was it in the UK was it somewhere else but I found that in some things Sheik Imran was um you know like he was um like frustrated and like I think a bit agitated so I don't know whether maybe he was you know on a tight schedule he needed to go somewhere so he didn't you know he was in a hurry and um because he kept saying that you know

five rupees of common sense if a person has five rupees of common sense no no no no no it's it's it it goes ways back because every time you know you know that I think that you know that he got a very got it got an interesting relationship between the the Orthodox Christian and him and and EV values the relationship and sometimes he got he got he get some stances about about the Christian and about uh the the status of a Christian about the salvation of Christian

yeah so so yeah there was a point where he where Dilly does ask him that you know would you care to expand on that and I really wanted him to expand I thought you know like I was curious that I just wanted to know what he was what was his reasoning and what what was he exactly saying because he says that look this is in the Quran and he says that would you care to explain and he says no I'm not going to explain and and he says you know move on like talk about and and I thought oh that that's a shame I wanted to hear that so if anybody that is in close communication with Sheik Imran Hussein

sees this or he comes across their attention and sure you know if if you if if if the Sheik is uh happy to have a discussion with me I would love to have a discussion sure yeah but but right yeah yeah yeah but just just just just just just that I think like having a discussion with him and clarifying like if people random people can point is it is it like being as as a Sunni Muslim do we which type of

person can Define and can point to uh problem you know the problem the problem with that the now is that look you know I've got a video already on YouTube called the birth of Orthodoxy see the problem with this is it just doesn't like it's a redundant explanation because if people already have parameters like let's say you know it doesn't make a difference like they just wouldn't accept they wouldn't be interested if you are a deviant to them then you already are a deviant it doesn't make a

difference this is why to me that stuff is less interesting and what's more interesting is maybe from a practical perspective explaining this concept of Mercy this concept of divine love that you know having that compassion for people even when we disagree with them uh and and also I guess there's a a maturation you know there's a trying becoming mature process isn't and I'm a victim of this as well I think you know I've uh like you know when I think back of myself as well my own journey of trying to mature

so and everybody's on this journey so you know I I get it but inshah Allah make things easy for each and all yeah yeah yeah yeah so that's that's all thanks for bringing that thank always thank always for your time tce and chuk and and thanks thanks to everybody byebye all right people that was right with us all right and we got into some interesting uh discussions there right let me right well I'm not going to let's see let's bring on

some what's this what's going on here write some questions on on Free Will right okay what shall we do shall we do another brief um let's who do we have here we've got um who do we have we've got oh got quite a few people have jumped on but I really haven't got that much time unfortunately I've got a very early start in the morning all right so F all right assalam alayum F wel Salam all right I like you know what I like

the setup of the room you know behind you the way it's it's kind of it's like organized man I like it it's good all right how are you and where are you joining us from again for uh I'm in London London you've been on the on before haven't you I yeah I've been on a few times yeah yeah yeah you haven't yes yes yes I thought so unless I was mixing you up all right fim how are you and any interesting thoughts or ideas to share with us oh yeah

um so it's about uh you know Miracles and uh so I I I accept your view on um like Miracles not being a supernatural thing um but I'm a bit confused on how the the prophet meeting angel jabriel isn't a supernatural event so a lot of the times I'll be asked that question like if you don't believe in miracles and what happened in the cave right okay so I right let me reord it's not that are things seen supernaturally they may be seen

supernaturally that's not the issue or some things may be Supernatural to an it depends on how what we mean by that that so let's say for example the soul may not be something from nature in this sense so it may be Supernatural and so it's not that I'm against in any way I'm fully embracing the supernatural so and there's many things you know there's all these Dimensions that are above nature in that sense you know they are Supernatural and like

so all of these things the s whole um you know Revelation Allah above all all these things are in in that understanding of they're Supernatural so that's nobody everybody's embracing that that's not what I mean by so very simply put what I was saying the the difference of opinion on Miracles is that when miracles happen do is there a is there something making them like is there a cause taking place

are there means adopted to make them happen so this is um or is it without a mean like is there no means and no medium and nothing and it's just happening or is it by a means just as other means are happening even if it's not obvious to people or it's being left out the details not being said so for example uh when the sea splits everybody accepts the sea splits was there a means that happened like so for example the strong winds that came in at the Gulf of

akaba and thereby split the sea did Allah adopt the means to make it or did was it just there's no means it's just going to happen so this is a point of disagreement it's doesn't really have a major it's not really a big deal but I think some people misunderstand it to make it into a big deal but it's not really that look at the end of the day the means are also created by Allah it's not that so that's quite simply putting it down to that now does that this view if this world has rules that Allah has

created and when things happen do they happen according to those rules um or do they violate the rules that Allah has created for this world so certain people are me amongst them would feel that when Allah has created rules for the cosmos and for the universe then things that happen within this universe happen by those rules because Allah has created those so just say for example uh in this Cosmos the arrow of time Flows In One Direction now time we know through physics is for the most

part an illusion but for us in the cosmos so in theoretical physics we understand that but practically the arrow of time and entropy Works in a particular way so Allah has created the universe for entropy and the laws of thermodynamics to work in this way so do they just stop working at a certain point no because Allah has created them so they always work so this is now now a point of I don't think really if people understood the argument would disagree with it but I think they in you know they don't

really give much attention to understanding that side of the argument so they think maybe this is an attack on which It Isn't So that's all so that's the disagreement so when you now accept this yes certain things you you may see a different interpretation to them okay so that's um as to your point on the angel jib you know jibra or jiel as both you can be can be said both ways in Arabic um the angel gibel the prophet sallallahu alaihi wasallam when he would

see the angel jiel he would be seeing into what is called he's not he's is seeing into so other people wouldn't see jel you know like the companions would never say oh we s you know oh there's jiel they would never nobody else would the prophet is seeing into that Dimension which is which is the which is that the Unseen which is that you know the veil he's having that removal of the veil and he can see into that that's what's

um happening with uh W with these you know Angelic apparitions and so on you so it's some so somebody may not um some people may see it different they may say no it's happening as in maybe they don't accept an so they' don't so I think a lot of people don't really have a like a cartography of the Realms they don't I think because I think it's quite you know it's mindboggling for people so a lot of people don't really think of it

like that so what is the bar for example they don't really think about it like they think maybe it's some hyperspace but they don't really think about it no the the scholars their Scholars haven't really spoken about most Scholars haven't spoken about it what what is this the world of pure Consciousness or Souls like people say oh yeah there's there's a world there's a dimension of pure conscious what is it how does it interact they've not really thought about it or they or the scholars that they've read haven't really written about that so to them well they they're familiar

with some of these terms but they don't really have a map or even even if it's I'm not saying it's a onetoone fit map but there's no cartography at all so they just it's just a free for all in that sense so to them that okay there is this world of the material and everything is then happening in this world because that's the only World they've thought about so like when they're saying well you know and and I guess they just really haven't thought about it you know it's like if I if somebody asks your question in a particular question you may think well

I've never really thought about that question and now that I'm thinking about it hm what do I think about it so this is how it is with these things so because and and other uh people you know great Scholars like him have have actually delineated and given this kind of understanding of and the symbolic order the the imaginary order the kind of symbolic hyperspace the the other kind of Dimensions so it all fits in brilliantly you know how it ties in with the with the Deep unconscious how it so you can

you can watch my videos on that so it makes uh sense you know that that's so that's one way of looking at it that these things like seeing the angel jbel would be of seeing into so even though he's here but he's here in the sense that he's in that Dimension here so he's so even though he's seeing him but what he's seeing is of the dimension of it's not of this material matter so yeah so that if that makes

sense now yes that's I don't know how much more I can cram in one uh brief paragraph of trying to explain so you're looking at a lot of kind of hyperspace and different um dimensions in a way and the dimensions they're not you see you have to remember that even this world of material is it's an illusion it's not actually here in the sense we think it's here this is a configuration ultimately it's like a simulation it's not real the

way we think it's real it's real to us because we're part of the configuration but it's not really real even in physics this is not I mean that's the crazy part even in science today well atoms are 99.9% not empty space so there's nothing actually there so if existence is for the most part utterly non-existent so what but yet it gives the illusion and this is something we'll speak about when I address the real in uh my coming in the next session in Islamic psychology the feel

in um in in this you know when in the configuration so if this is an epiphenomenon and it is an emergent property then you see these Dimensions all interlock like where is consciousness where is the unconscious where is the Deep unconscious it's it's it's here and at the same time not here so where is it it's an interlocking Dimension isn't it so this is how these worlds are like they are like that they are

dimensions so people they see into these things now when you see into it like obviously the prophet is seeing into so even though the angel is there he's not he's there but in the sense that but there for the prophet so it's like that probably won't makes holder you uh I'm going to be 23 in August there's a bit of a track to go but you'll get there in the end took me a long while to to to to for for things like that to kind of make sense to

me yeah I think I had to I think you got to go beyond the mid-30s and then they start but you I mean you might grasp them much sooner but I'm just saying that they you at first it sounds absurd but then you have to toy with it you have to explore it you have to read you have to um you see it sounds absurd at first but it's like it's like if somebody told you that all of matter is 99.999% not there you think that's stupid but that's hard science today to

deny that be stupid it would just mean that you just don't know physics so but in our day-to-day life we don't see the world in that way you know we don't it's enough for us to accept it but it's really absurd to us like we accept it as a fact you know it's like what's the capital of France it's Paris and what's you know uh so somebody says well 99.999% of atoms are empty space you know oh it's it's just a statement but the truth is that that is reality although it doesn't correlate with our

reality so but we know it now so when you start toying that wait a minute what have all of these people who are these mathematicians and physicists and you know Brilliant Minds what have they arrived at like let's toy at it you know let's try and see what is this so when you start exploring you start realizing hm like this is not as frivolous as I may have first thought you know if all these bright Minds like Einstein and Neils bore and all these you know Fineman and these you know some of the

leading brightest you know uh brains of the 20th century have all been discussing Maxwell all these people have been discussing this what what are they talking about you know are they just all stupid and in Ane and mental and so and you start going into this and and then you start exploring what is consciousness and the question now of the 21st century and the late 20th century and especially the 21st centuries what on Earth is consciousness where does it come from where is it you know so when you start exploring this and seeing the greatest

Minds talk about you toy with these ideas like you explore that how do how does this then you start to see all of a sudden you will see things differently like you'll start to realize H like I've been you know living in a bubble like I'm I've that you ironically I've been a victim of Hardcore materialism when the truth which you know Islam knew from the beginning but you know many that this it is not it is a material real world but it's

for the most part an illusion but we we are part of the that so we can't tell you know it's like we're in the game so in The Matrix so to speak so we obviously it's real to us when you're in a dream the dream is real you know you don't in a dream you don't feel like if you get hit in a dream it will hurt if you get hungry in a dream you will be hungry because the dream you when you're in it it is real this is a dream you know all that we see or see is but a dream within a Dream Within a

dream you know that that ASD said you know this and I feel that Muslim thinkers and Mystics they were so far you know they really were Geniuses you know at what they did and I think we just this part of Islam has been so under appreciated because it's complicated I guess you know it's mystical it doesn't like but physics nowadays is Mystical isn't it

wouldn't you think a lot of physics is going in that direction it's becoming very mystical it's coming trying to Fathom Consciousness it's trying to obviously you nobody knows where to begin but you know even this thing of time the block Universe isn't that quite all these things are weird now Quantum field theory that you know now there's there's there's no such thing as atoms even you know they're just excitations aren't they so we've just got fields which have excitations quantum physics superp position everything is in every position until it collapses the quantum wave collapses doesn't that seem

absurd that everything like so you know out of my let's say a nano scale and subatomic scale this cup is everywhere it's not just it could be everywhere actually is everywhere until the quantum wave collapses and then it's only here so how do we explain that but it's physics today you know it is the it's the the belief of science so isn't that rather mystical and so I feel that when we're speaking about these hyperspaces and you know I mentioned this in my symbolic

order of um or was it in the imaginary order when I spoke of um but in the last one two sessions about uh the dream Space by you know Dr broad Dr Price when they spoke of this in the 50s that where they hypothesized a a kind of space called The Dream space but this is why I feel that the more we learn the more realize how little we know and it also helps us to emerge out of our bubble and we have to move away from this Hardline

materialism that you know we are that this pure Material World see it's ironic because you see when we began about the question on Miracles it was almost being posed in a way as if there's a you know a an overreliance on material but when we explain it in this way it's shocking that most people then resort to materialism and they they they shy away from all this hyperspace and you know the and all of these dimensions and and

they only resort to the hard felt material world around them which is you know it doesn't make any sense so right okay well you know that got interesting I'm going to you know what it's been a pleasure for him speaking to you and I you know hope you're not too late for your uh is it is it still uni no you must be on break now from uni or is it is it yes yes well so I I did

um I I graduated from uni in uh 2023 uh so last year and then since then I've been doing um teacher training oh um but so now I'm doing interviews so I have a few offers from some some different colleges so I have another interview today um so I was just preparing my lesson for that it was on um like magnetism in an electric motor so like the the motor

effect um so I was trying to do that while I was listening to the what and what subjects will you be teach is it secondary you're going for and and just are you isolated in particular subjects or you cross field or what's your uh so when I was doing the training it was a bunch of it was in secondary school um I was teaching science up up to GCSE um I also did physics at a level um and hopefully like next year I'm trying to get into college so it will be more um like a level and btech T level so those kinds of

things um teaching W you know been there done that what a journey huh that I I I stopped teaching 11 years ago in so God see you would have just been in school then so yeah you know teaching gives you um it does give you a um an incredible skill set that I think if transferred to other areas do work very well as well they work well in

life you know there's just something about um that whole management like behavior management uh speaking in a way commanding author like the ability to just come in and speak and how to structure how to assess how to kind of evaluate weaknesses how to kind of set out teaching methods these things and the ability as well to just uh like you know public speaking in a way so it is uh it is these These are invaluable gifts I must

say I I think how long was was I in teaching I was in teaching um since I think 2005 till 2013 I think 2005 2006 something like that yeah I think 206 was it yeah till 2013 yeah and so many years enough years and to get all of that experience and but yeah it is it does really drain it is a brain drain as well man you know it really exhausts people and and I think what you see I think now teaching has changed

especially in the UK it's become so bureaucratized so um when I got into teaching it was but it was nothing like what it's become so there was still a bit of that free spirit to it you know back then like in 2005 2006 200 ah funing games H when when schools were still under the local authorities they were under the LA Lea now they're all academized they're private companies yeah MH and so yeah so they're a lot more ruthless in how they're very corporate in how they so back then you used to have

um these two key books the blue book and what was it the Burgundy book that you went by I don't think you guys would have them now would you or do you still have you still go by the blue book and the so that was like the you know the teacher rights and the teach but now because it's a private contract between you and a company so it's a journey Allah bless it for you man and make things easy right well I'll leave you with that fim all right you have a good evening or a good night andah much success with your uh with your interview okay speak

soon people that was for him and what a discussion huh right with that we've gone on one hour coming up to 40 minutes let's wrap this up it's been an absolute pleasure seeing you guys speaking you know just having one of these uh meetups I've got to do more of these it is a pleasure to it's it's so good to see so many of you jump on actually and just catch up say Salam share thoughts ideas and yeah so Allah bless you all I'm going to call it a night if you want

to reach out to me you're more than welcome to do so on Instagram uh just the general kind of mediums Instagram I do try to check the messages leave a comment by the way on videos share your thoughts and and you know it's it's um it's also it does uh I do take my time to try to read them so yeah and I do do try to answer some things but I'll be it briefly but Instagram if you're looking for detailed onetoone perspective sessions then you can head over to

patreon.com slm and you can select the tiers they do they allow you from there to join my Discord group and also they do allow uh from tier two allows one to one perspective sessions and you've got like a spectrum of things but yeah and we do have um group Chats on the like I have lives on my Discord as well so but that's just for the Discord group that I do actually have uh at least a couple sometimes more every month so but I guess you know it's like almost like I we know everybody there

now so right people Allah keep you blessed and you know May yeah this journey continue to unveil the Divine mysteries for us all amen and may Allah shower you with countless blessings and unimaginable abundance amen and may your light always shine bright take very good care of yourselves