# Did a tree really cry for the Prophet, and why does Mufti Abu Layth reject the hadith? *The crying tree hadith and the demand for one standard: 'we do not need a tree to prove the Prophet'* - URL: https://muftiabulayth.org/r/uuldzklvxvo/s/17/ - Date: 2018-04-09 · Kind: lesson · Transcript tier: machine · Recording: The Role Of Reason In Religion - Mufti Abu Layth (1:17:02–1:19:39) - Status: general teaching - Watch from the start of the segment: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UuLDZkLvxvo&t=4622s - Recording page: https://muftiabulayth.org/r/uuldzklvxvo/ **Topics:** Prophethood and miracles; Text criticism, reason and the Quran; Responses to critics **Summary (not a quotation; machine-made, unchecked):** Mufti Abu Layth does not hold the crying-tree reports to be established: their chains are problematic and Muslims cannot call other religions' miracle stories absurd while accepting their own; the Prophet's greatness does not depend on a tree. **Checked position (checked by two independent reviews, not by the channel):** Mufti Abu Layth holds that the report of the tree crying for the Prophet is not established, that its chains are problematic and it clashes with the principle that such things do not happen, and that Muslims cannot dismiss other religions' miracle stories as absurd while accepting their own. **Evidence, his words at 1:17:24:** “I said this is not established and I don't believe this to be sahi why because how can we hold things like stones and monkeys and elephants not doing these kind of things and hold that as absurd” (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UuLDZkLvxvo&t=4644s) ## Longer summary Mufti Abu Layth says that those who want to refute him look for a scholar he has praised and quote him against him. He recalls being asked recently about the tree said to have cried in the time of the Prophet, and answering that it is not established and that he does not hold it sahih, because one cannot call stones, monkeys and elephants doing such things absurd while allowing trees to do them; consistency requires one yardstick, not one for oneself and another for Hinduism. When a Muslim replied that it is different because Allah allowed it for the Prophet, he asked how one knows Allah did not allow it for Krishna or Rama, since once anything goes reason is abandoned and no scary monster can be disproved, so the best faculty Allah gave, reason, must be the guide. He says he showed the problems in the chains of the crying-tree reports, that they go against the principled understanding that such things do not happen, and that Muslims do not need a crying tree to prove the Prophet's greatness, since he is the greatest of people to them. He adds that people reacted with refutations, and begins to describe how they used a scholar he rates. ## Sources and names cited - report: the tree crying for the prophet - one set of standards: judge Islam's claims by the same test applied to other religions ## Transcript (machine tier, 1:17:02–1:19:39) [1:16:45] passionate about it but it doesn't mean even the Malik this is Imam Malik teaching you these are the principles that look it's not about like having it we're not a cult it's like somebody said to me oh well if that's the case you know you and what's shocking is when people want to refute me this is this is a this is the logic people have so what they'll do is they'll find a scholar that I've spoken highly of and I got aha so like okay recently I don't know if you guys have watched but there was this whole thing about I had tackled I was asked a question about this tree in the time of the Prophet that apparently [1:17:24] cried and stuff like this and so I said this is not established and I don't believe this to be sahi why because how can we hold things like stones and monkeys and elephants not doing these kind of things and hold that as absurd because it doesn't make sense but then say it's okay for trees to do stuff like these because trees don't do that kind of stuff either you know you can't like you gotta have consistency you can't have one yardstick for you and a different one for me because that's called double standards like I can't say well oh I'm not gonna believe in in in this happening because ahaha that's dumb [1:18:02] in Hinduism but oh but here oh but this is all right this is us though I I said this to a Muslim he said yeah but that's different because Allah allowed it for the Prophet I said how do you know a larger than allow it for Krishna or for Rama for these people how do you know God you know Brahma didn't allow it like so because all of a sudden now anything goes now it's just like it doesn't even matter we don't need reason it's just like anything you know the subjective monster out there how do you know disprove it there's no scary monster out there I can't disprove it okay so we gotta go with the best faculty Allah has given us [1:18:41] which is reason so I said this in a hobby I said that the hadith of Jeremy's different hadith about this tree crying I said it's not established okay I said the hadith of a and a problematize I showed the problems in them and I said this goes against our principle understanding of Islam that these things don't happen so and we don't need a crying tree to prove that the Prophet was a great person to us he's the greatest of people we don't need a tree to prove that to us so when I said this so obviously people kind of reacted to this whole thing and [1:19:20] and they've made this whole kind of all these kind of reputations and and people bring up all this well oh oh my god you know well if you're gonna if you're gonna say if you're gonna also this is it almost lost my train of thought so so what they did is they found this scholar that I normally rate as an example I called the EON now he's an amazing scholar from the Maliki method from Muslim Spain and I always kind of big up laughs colors of the past but I you know some of these Don's of Muslim Spain I'm a huge fan of so I said yeah you know I'll say yeah at the dawn the legend ## Cite Mufti Abu Layth Archive, segment UuLDZkLvxvo/s/17. https://muftiabulayth.org/r/uuldzklvxvo/s/17/ Not a fatwa: these answers were given to specific people at specific times. Ask a qualified scholar about your own situation.