# Who were the Murji'a and why do Salafis talk about them so much?

*Why Salafis go on about the Murji'a, and Mufti Abu Layth on Ibn Taymiyya*

- URL: https://muftiabulayth.org/r/jtyem-eee78/s/15/
- Date: 2020-09-22 · Kind: question · Transcript tier: machine · Recording: Monday Nights with Mufti #183 | Q&A Unscripted & Unrestricted! 😉 | Mufti Abu Layth (1:18:25–1:24:50)
- Status: general teaching
- Watch from the start of the segment: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jTYEM-eEe78&t=4705s
- Recording page: https://muftiabulayth.org/r/jtyem-eee78/

**Topics:** Salafism and Wahhabism; Scholars and imams of the past; Creed and the schools of theology

**Question as asked:** Can you talk about the Murji'a, specifically why Salafis hate them?

**Summary (not a quotation; machine-made, unchecked):** Mufti Abu Layth says Salafis fixate on long-extinct sects because they read Ibn Taymiyya, whom he sees as a troubled man with mental health issues whom they all but worship.

**Checked position (checked by two independent reviews, not by the channel):** Mufti Abu Layth says Ibn Taymiyya suffered from a lot of mental health issues.

**Evidence, his words at 1:22:15:** “but he you have to understand he was he suffered from a lot of mental health issues” (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jTYEM-eEe78&t=4935s)

## Longer summary

Answering why Salafis always talk about the Murji'a, Mufti Abu Layth says they live in a 'cuckoo world' of books on deviant sects that have not existed for seven hundred to twelve hundred years, because they read Ibn Taymiyya, whom he calls obsessed with sectarianism. Mufti says he finds Ibn Taymiyya's thinking fascinating at times and admires some of his forward-thinking ijtihad, but that he was a very troubled man who, Mufti says, would have suffered from some kind of personality disorder, since prominent admirers who invited him ended up hating him after he refuted them. He recounts Ibn Taymiyya's imprisonment, his brother's death in prison and the beatings he suffered, says this would leave anyone bitter, and says Salafis in practice place him on a par with or just beneath the Prophet, as the Shia place Ali. He ends with a story he says he has read, that Ibn Taymiyya had slave girls read fiqh books outside the toilet door so he missed nothing.

## Sources and names cited

- Murji'a
- Salafi
- Ibn Taymiyya
- Wahhabi
- Ali ibn Abi Talib

## Transcript (machine tier, 1:18:25–1:24:50)

[1:18:24] about and why do the selfies always go on about it because the selfies just live in a cuckoo world [Laughter] you know the selfies they live like they just taught books of of of iraq sects that are deviant and this sect is this deviant sect that believes this and is going to hell this sect is this and it's going to hell so all they do is know those names of those groups those groups haven't existed sometimes for a thousand years uh sometimes they haven't existed for 1200 years sometimes they haven't existed for 700 years

[1:19:04] 600 they have not existed these are pre-modern these are like from the antiquity but to them because that's all they read they just read ibn te mia de dada who just writes who was obsessed with sectarianism you know hypnotamia as well he's just this character isn't he i mean i do find him sometimes fascinating his way of thinking but then he's so um he he was he would have been somebody that would have suffered from like some kind of a personality

[1:19:43] disorder because it's really weird like you know people you'll have stories of people uh prominent people that will invite him that they will be huge fans of his i and they they are prominent as well they will invite him and he will then just be so we like he'll refute them and then they'll go on to hate him and it's just he see he sure the interesting things he says fine but he he was unfortunately a troubled man a very troubled person who

[1:20:22] struggled with a lot of stuff and had a lot of hate inside of him and um for whatever reason you know maybe sociological reasons and then obviously he got imprisoned his family got imprisoned his brother was in prison his brother died whilst in prison being in prison and yeah you know the whole thing people did you know people did obviously conspire against him as well and they succeeded because he got battered got beaten up chucked in prison left there for years tortured you know like when that happens to you you become a bit loopy you know that that unfortunately i'm not saying that's a

[1:21:01] that's tragic to happen to anyone but it did and he's this very bitter person when it comes to sectarianism hates on people calls them a deviant calls them this and yeah and the salafi is like next to worship him this is another problem you know the selfies to him he might as well just be the prophet to them ibn samir is a how ali is to the shia seriously i'm not joking

[1:21:38] is perceived to the shia as being up there absolutely up there maybe on a par if not just slightly beneath the prophet that's how ibn tamir is with the selfies he is like they won't admit it but in practice he's like either on par with the prophet or just slightly a notch beneath the prophet you know it's like uh some of the salafi said you know if it wasn't for his for him coming you know six seven hundred years after the prophet really he had excelled many companions

[1:22:15] [Laughter] okay this this is what the wahhabi dawa does to you you know these were hobbies honestly they have lost the plot [Laughter] you know i mean don't get me wrong i admired some things he says and he you know he's some of his each they had was forward thinking i admire that but he you have to understand he was he suffered from a lot of mental health issues

[1:22:53] and which weren't his fault but we have to understand that yeah he accepted the satanic verses but chara was like he never got married did he this is uh this is what happens when you're starved off of the opposite gender this is although i don't know whether he had i think he did have slave girls to be fair so um so i could be wrong about now actually i'm pretty sure he did have slave girls here because he would uh i've read about him in the past that he would even when he'd go to the toilet he'd have his slave girl

[1:23:31] read outside from the book you know like you know people today say that when you go to the toilet that you need to go with your phone or something otherwise you're like you know all of a sudden you're like picking up the air freshener and you're like wow that's so fascinating and [Laughter] so in the past ibna tamiya what he would do is he would have his slave girls stand outside the toilet door and read the fit books the sharia books and stuff so he's not missing out whilst he's [Laughter]

[1:24:09] ah your devotion he goes [Music] [Laughter] [Music] disagreed ah that's uh right right so let's uh right let's go on to this book that i wanted to speak about now

## Cite

Mufti Abu Layth Archive, segment jTYEM-eEe78/s/15. https://muftiabulayth.org/r/jtyem-eee78/s/15/

Not a fatwa: these answers were given to specific people at specific times. Ask a qualified scholar about your own situation.