# What did Ibn al-Arabi write about a classmate who was both bearded and breasted?

*Ibn al-Arabi's recollection of a bearded, breasted classmate with two servant girls*

- URL: https://muftiabulayth.org/r/ejs0ibhhpg0/s/3/
- Date: 2019-08-02 · Kind: lesson · Transcript tier: machine · Recording: Why are homosexual activities forbidden? | Mufti Abu Layth (11:42–17:24)
- Status: general teaching
- Watch from the start of the segment: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eJS0IBhhPg0&t=702s
- Recording page: https://muftiabulayth.org/r/ejs0ibhhpg0/

**Topics:** Scholars and imams of the past; Sexuality and orientation; Al-Andalus and the Maghrib

**Summary (not a quotation; machine-made, unchecked):** Qadi Abu Bakr ibn al-Arabi recorded a classmate with a beard and breasts who came to al-Ghazali's lessons with two servant girls and whose nature puzzled him for years. Mufti Abu Layth reads this as an example of people in the past finding outlets with servants and slaves.

**Checked position (checked by two independent reviews, not by the channel):** Mufti Abu Layth says that in the past, it seems, people who were stuck, such as those who were homosexual or bisexual without an apparent outlet, and presumably khuntha too, found a loophole with servants and slaves.

**Evidence, his words at 12:04:** “in the past it seems to be wherever people were kind of stuck they found a loophole if you like with servants” (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eJS0IBhhPg0&t=724s)

## Longer summary

Mufti Abu Layth says he will continue his research, but that wherever he has read about the khuntha in the fiqh books they say it cannot marry or be married, which he finds cruel. He then retells a story he has shared before from Qadi Abu Bakr ibn al-Arabi, the Maliki scholar and judge of Muslim Spain. He observes that in the past, whenever people were stuck, they seem to have found a loophole with servants and slaves: someone feeling homosexual or bisexual without an apparent outlet would resort to them, and presumably a khuntha would settle with servants and slaves too. Ibn al-Arabi, he says, writes in his journals that when he travelled east and studied with al-Ghazali [?], one student used to turn up to class with a big beard and large breasts, always accompanied by two servant girls, and that he wondered whether the man was more like a man or a woman and wanted to muster the courage to ask him but never did. Mufti notes that Ibn al-Arabi slides his journal into his works, including his commentary on al-Tirmidhi [?], and that writing more than ten years later he says the question still beat him and he wished he had asked. Mufti closes with the joke that whoever is weighed down by problems should remember a judge was weighed down by greater ones.

## Sources and names cited

- Qadi Abu Bakr ibn al-Arabi
- al-Ghazali [?]
- Aridat al-Ahwadhi (Ibn al-Arabi's commentary on al-Tirmidhi) [?]
- khuntha (hermaphrodite, intersex person)

## Transcript (machine tier, 11:42–17:24)

[11:26] think these layers when you look at them it demonstrates hmm so there's been these issues right so I hope that you know I mean the somebody said I mean the Ottomans weren't Caleb's then all the scholars say that yeah unfortunately yet I mean I'll I'll still continue my research I've not so extensively researched on Thurs hermaphrodite but wherever I have read about them in the fake books throughout the years they've always just said Latin Carol a tonka cannot marry

[12:04] and nobody can marry it and I think that's so cruel but what was interesting and I shared this story once before ages ago is you see call dia what what could even otter be you know the Maliki legend from Muslim Spain now he speaks about you see because what's interesting is in the past it seems to be wherever people were kind of stuck they found a loophole if you like with servants and this is I mean it's like it's like it's just

[12:41] another layer of drama isn't it so it's like somebody had asked before what was their attitude towards homosexuality so what they would do is they would just if they were feeling bisexual or homosexual or bisexual then if they didn't have an apparent outlet they would just do that with their servants and slaves and the same thing here with hunters presumably hunters would then just settle with servants and slaves and things like that if they could afford them now all the evocative Nairobi who is a legend of

[13:20] Muslim Spain from 900 years ago he writes in some of his journals that when he traveled to the east in his time so he bumps into Yamahas early and he studies with him on gazelle he studies with him in the desert so he one of his his kind of recollections he writes that I remember they used to be this guy that used to turn up to class and so remember their intense they were out in the the kind of desert wilderness if you like so then there are any people out there and so they they and they would turn up to

[13:59] class and it's just now very there ain't many facilities there ain't many things but there one of the students was this one sir he was a guy so even though arabe writes about him the Maliki scholar and the judge and [ __ ] he says this guy used to turn up he said he had a big beard right and like he was apparently like a man but he said at the same time he had like - he'll I get big breasts so this guy would turn over here big breasts

[14:36] sorry breasts big beard no that's called a copy of working even Larabee what kind of thoughts are you putting in my mom Bobby where are you I'm gonna have to burn his books now so right so call do what Knievel are we say is that he says he would turn up to class and he used to have these two kind of servant girls with him all the time so they used to turn up as well he says

[15:15] I used to think to myself does he get it on with them so what can a mulatto be is writing this in his in his in his books and he says I used to think to myself does he get it on like is he more like a mind or is he like a woman hmm and you see and he says I wanted to go and ask him I wanted to kind of muster the courage and turn up and ask him that

[15:49] look listen do you mind a woman and he says but I never got to and when he's writing this journal see the awesome thing about working on our bzees he kind of slides his journal into all his works his commentaries on hadith and things like this like in his masala khorinis odda that allow these commentary on tell me the e of the Mokpo or things like this now he says that and when I'm writing this it's been 10 years now like 10 years ago this was and he says

[16:28] oh I think longer than 10 years actually but he says that he's writing this years later and he says that it still it still beats him this thing does that was the was the guy getting it on or not was it was he a man really a woman what was and he says even now I wish I just asked him [Laughter] so you know whenever you're bothered with some thoughts on a strange day you want to honor on a depressed day or when you're really struggle struggling with

[17:07] some challenges and your mind is is weighing down on you remember that there was a copy out there who was weighed down with greater problems than yours [Laughter]

## Cite

Mufti Abu Layth Archive, segment eJS0IBhhPg0/s/3. https://muftiabulayth.org/r/ejs0ibhhpg0/s/3/

Not a fatwa: these answers were given to specific people at specific times. Ask a qualified scholar about your own situation.