# Are the Jabir chains for the crying-tree hadith through Isra'il, Abd al-Razzaq and Ibn Jurayj sound? *The Jabir chains: Isra'il and an unknown narrator; Abd al-Razzaq, Ibn Jurayj and 'akhbarani'* - URL: https://muftiabulayth.org/r/8u9-aslyrze/s/9/ - Date: 2018-02-21 · Kind: lesson · Transcript tier: machine · Recording: Reply to Sunni (Wahhabi) Defence Pt.I -Mufti Abu Layth (31:15–36:28) - Status: general teaching - Watch from the start of the segment: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8U9-ASlyrzE&t=1875s - Recording page: https://muftiabulayth.org/r/8u9-aslyrze/ **Topics:** Narrator criticism; Authenticating hadith; Responses to critics **Summary (not a quotation; machine-made, unchecked):** Mufti Abu Layth argues they are not: one chain rests on Isra'il, whom Yahya ibn Sa'id and Ibn al-Madini weakened, and an unknown narrator; the other on Abd al-Razzaq, criticised for errors from memory, and Ibn Jurayj, a mudallis whose 'akhbarani' referred to books rather than hearing. ## Longer summary Mufti Abu Layth turns to the chains from Jabir that the critics said he left out. The first, through Yahya ibn Adam [?] from Isra'il from Abu Ishaq [?], he says fails because Ibn Ma'in transmits from Yahya ibn Sa'id al-Qattan that he would not accept Isra'il and considered him weak, as did Ali ibn al-Madini, and because a narrator in the chain is described as unknown, transmitted only by Abu Ishaq, whom Imam Muslim lists in his book of narrators with a single transmitter [?]. The second, which the critics called one of the most solid, runs Abd al-Razzaq from Ibn Jurayj from Abu al-Zubayr from Jabir. On Abd al-Razzaq al-San'ani he quotes Ibn Hibban [?] that he made mistakes when relying on memory, Abu Hatim that his hadith are written but not used as evidence alone, al-Nasa'i listing him among the weak [?], al-Dhahabi in the Mizan that he has rejected reports, and Imam Ahmad in the 'Ilal that he transmitted fabricated things including a well-known sahifa [?]. On Ibn Jurayj he says al-Daraqutni called him a serious mudallis who must say 'haddathani' to be accepted, and that although this chain has 'akhbarani Abu al-Zubayr', Ali ibn al-Madini transmits from Yahya ibn Sa'id that when Ibn Jurayj says 'akhbarani' it is nothing, since he means only that he had the books, Shu'ba having watched him come to al-Zuhri and others with books and ask to transmit them. He says he is only relaying the words of the critics about these great men. ## Sources and names cited - Sunni Defence (YouTube channel) - Jabir ibn Abdullah - Yahya ibn Adam [?] - Isra'il [?] - Abu Ishaq [?] - Yahya ibn Ma'in - Yahya ibn Sa'id al-Qattan - Ali ibn al-Madini - Imam Muslim - al-Munfaridat wa'l-Wuhdan [?] - Abd al-Razzaq al-San'ani - Ibn Jurayj - Abu al-Zubayr - Ibn Hibban [?] - Abu Hatim al-Razi - al-Nasa'i - al-Dhahabi - Mizan al-I'tidal - Imam Ahmad ibn Hanbal - al-'Ilal of Imam Ahmad [?] - al-Daraqutni - Shu'ba - al-Zuhri - tadlis (mudallis) - majhul (unknown narrator) - munkar (rejected report) - report: the tree crying for the prophet ## Transcript (machine tier, 31:15–36:28) [31:02] the pawn chain right so right so that was his first he brings this chain right okay then he goes on to say well okay he brings another chain right now he goes back to jabya they bring these chains to say Musti Abu layth left these chains oh and the chain is yeah yeah Adam says had definite Israel and obvious Huck I'm sorry did na'vi curb I'm Jarrett of not [31:38] Abdullah okay first of all right even mine transmits from yeah here Messiah Dominica pan that he would not accept Israel and would consider him die Eve and what did allele Medini also say about Israel naive but if so this Israel but let's what about let's go further in the chain so he did not become a leave no Medina says that Lemurian Valero [32:14] Abbas heart whoa a mudhole he is an unknown person we do not accept him we do not accept him people and even Muslim put him in Easter furrow that right he mentions him in his book and 140 that from those people who other people did not transmit from so he only has a boy's heart transmitted from him but let's not stop there then they bring another chain they say here's one of the most solid chains one of the most solid chains right so what is one of the most solid chains Abdul Razak from a blue jay rage [32:53] from a buzu Bay from Jabbar or the Olajuwon nice or rather this or not nice now you playing games so this is where they say this is where there's that dialogue that [33:20] game a cheeky Leone but I'd neither let you know you played it well you just chose the wrong opponent that's all a [Laughter] Chava or shall I say booter it's Mac listen up scootch a man listen to me right let's take a look at this Senate beginning with up the Raza Asuna honey Allah oh yeah Betty listen [33:58] to me what does it mean hey ban say about the result what can I mean you did and he was from those people who would make mistakes especially if he relied upon his memory right Apple had him says we write his hadith well I said Juba we do not take him as an evidence Allah and a sir he mentions him from the Dava Nasir is mentioning him from the door father he says were [34:34] feeding another and the Hobby says in his bees and who we are and a hadith mauna kea an imam ahmed in the ll in the Shara of Ellen Ellen mentions that he would transmit certain things from him that were actually mobile including the sahifa which is a well-known sahifa right so so this is another so that's up the rose artisan hani let's take a look at it nerd rage rage let's take a look at George and these are great people but [35:13] I'm just transmitting the Kalam the Kootenay what does that put me say about him Kabir he says his club that he is Kabir what that lease right and there B says that he needs to say had Bethenny for us to accept accept his rewired now they're going to say oh but in this chain he says a brawny he says aspirin e Abu Zubaydah so let's take a look at that in noting that I knew you're gonna bring this one [35:52] let's let's see what does Ali Al Madina say from ya here inside America pan that when if nurturing each is a caller if not H a Bahraini for who Allah shape it is nothing he's trying it because when he says Akbar Annie he means he just had the books what does Shabbos a shopper says I used to sit and watch it mature age come with just books and say to people like Zoe and other people I'm just gonna transmit these from you okay and they would say okay and shop bar would be like I used ## Cite Mufti Abu Layth Archive, segment 8U9-ASlyrzE/s/9. https://muftiabulayth.org/r/8u9-aslyrze/s/9/ Not a fatwa: these answers were given to specific people at specific times. Ask a qualified scholar about your own situation.